The "How Do You Pronounce X" Thread

[Richard W]

Those do seem quite common changes with young British speakers.

What, like under 90?

The /θ/~/f/ merger is quite widespread, though it used to be thought of as Cockney. So is the merger of post-vocalic /ð/ and /v/. I had them when young - possibly due to London overspill, though otherwise my speech was mostly lower middle class RP. However, to my hearing, the merger of word-initial /ð/ and /d/ is quite rare.

[Kuchigakatai]

Just imagine: it's the year 2122, and these θ > f and ð > d/v sound changes have become such a standard staple of pronunciation in England, especially in London, that Americans insist in listening to their Shakespeare with them, because otherwise it doesn't sound "authentic".

[Travis B.]

Just imagine: it's the year 2122, and these θ > f and ð > d/v sound changes have become such a standard staple of pronunciation in England, especially in London, that Americans insist in listening to their Shakespeare with them, because otherwise it doesn't sound "authentic".

I can picture this, even though to me at the present these changes still specifically evoke London and environs and not England in general.

[foxcatdog]

In most cases i have *f for *θ so *think or *thin is [fɪŋk] and [fɪn] as well as ether as [i:fər]
But *ð becomes *d word initially and *v elsewhere so *the [də] and *this [dɪs] but *with [wɪv]

I presume you're British?

Nup australian.

[bradrn]

In most cases i have *f for *θ so *think or *thin is [fɪŋk] and [fɪn] as well as ether as [i:fər]
But *ð becomes *d word initially and *v elsewhere so *the [də] and *this [dɪs] but *with [wɪv]

I presume you're British?

Nup australian.

Huh, I never realised. I personally don’t have this change, but I’ve noticed it in other young Australians.

[Jonlang]

Have I been pronouncing cases wrong? I've been saying (mostly in my head because I seldom need to actually speak about noun declensions) things like allative as [ə.ˈlɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] and locative as [loʊ̯.ˈkʰɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] (the same first two syllables as location).

[Richard W]

Have I been pronouncing cases wrong? I've been saying (mostly in my head because I seldom need to actually speak about noun declensions) things like allative as [ə.ˈlɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] and locative as [loʊ̯.ˈkʰɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] (the same first two syllables as location).

I would expect allative to rime with ablative as in 'case' rather than ablative as in 'tile'. Moreover the -ative is also unstressed in nominative, vocative and accusative. Unstressedness is not possible in dative. I learnt Latin as school.

[WarpedWartWars]

Something that the one about "Illinois" makes me think of is that there are all these people with [ɔ]--Illin[ɔ]is--but I have [o]--Illin[o]is.

[Travis B.]

Something that the one about "Illinois" makes me think of is that there are all these people with [ɔ]--Illin[ɔ]is--but I have [o]--Illin[o]is.

In every English variety I have heard of, Illinois ends in a diphthong - [ɔɪ̯] - and I have never heard of it contrasting with a *[oɪ̯], or being pronounced with two vowels in hiatus.

[foxcatdog]

Something that the one about "Illinois" makes me think of is that there are all these people with [ɔ]--Illin[ɔ]is--but I have [o]--Illin[o]is.

In every English variety I have heard of, Illinois ends in a diphthong - [ɔɪ̯] - and I have never heard of it contrasting with a *[oɪ̯], or being pronounced with two vowels in hiatus.

Personally i have the spelling pronounciation [ɪ.lɪ.nois]

[WarpedWartWars]

Something that the one about "Illinois" makes me think of is that there are all these people with [ɔ]--Illin[ɔ]is--but I have [o]--Illin[o]is.

In every English variety I have heard of, Illinois ends in a diphthong - [ɔɪ̯] - and I have never heard of it contrasting with a *[oɪ̯], or being pronounced with two vowels in hiatus.

I am not sure what you mean, but I pronounce it as [ɪ.ɫɪ.noj]--never [ɪ.ɫɪ.nɔɪ], [ɪ.ɫɪ.noɪ], or [ɪ.ɫɪ.nɔj]. That is, unless I'm pronouncing one or more of those for an example.

[Travis B.]

Something that the one about "Illinois" makes me think of is that there are all these people with [ɔ]--Illin[ɔ]is--but I have [o]--Illin[o]is.

In every English variety I have heard of, Illinois ends in a diphthong - [ɔɪ̯] - and I have never heard of it contrasting with a *[oɪ̯], or being pronounced with two vowels in hiatus.

I am not sure what you mean, but I pronounce it as [ɪ.ɫɪ.noj]--never [ɪ.ɫɪ.nɔɪ], [ɪ.ɫɪ.noɪ], or [ɪ.ɫɪ.nɔj]. That is, unless I'm pronouncing one or more of those for an example.

My point is that normally English is analyzed as having diphthongs here rather than vowel-semivowel pairs, as shown by that one only gets a high front glide before [a]~[ɑ], [ə]~[ʌ]*, and [ɔ] in most English varieties.

* Only varieties with raising of /aɪ/.

[Rounin Ryuuji]

Really getting into the weeds of what those diphthongs sound like when I say them, I think the /i/ in /ai ei ɔi/ and the /u/ in /au ou/ would be, in both cases, slightly lowered and more centered, but not so far as to be in lax territory, something like [aï̯ e̞ï̯ ɔï̯ aü̯ ou̯]; note that my [a] is distinct from the palm vowel (I have both the lot-cloth and father-bother mergers), which is [ɑ]. If I had /ai/ > /a/, it would probably produce a new phoneme, and not a spy-spa merger.

A lot of local people seem to do what I mentally call oi-darkening — /ɔi/ becomes something like [ʌʊ̯], or might even merge with /ʌ/ in some speakers (producing a coil-cull merger, which I haven't heard discussed anywhere). Some just have it before /l/, but I've heard others doing it everywhere. Has anybody else noticed something like this?

[WarpedWartWars]

In every English variety I have heard of, Illinois ends in a diphthong - [ɔɪ̯] - and I have never heard of it contrasting with a *[oɪ̯], or being pronounced with two vowels in hiatus.

I am not sure what you mean, but I pronounce it as [ɪ.ɫɪ.noj]--never [ɪ.ɫɪ.nɔɪ], [ɪ.ɫɪ.noɪ], or [ɪ.ɫɪ.nɔj]. That is, unless I'm pronouncing one or more of those for an example.

My point is that normally English is analyzed as having diphthongs here rather than vowel-semivowel pairs, as shown by that one only gets a high front glide before [a]~[ɑ], [ə]~[ʌ]*, and [ɔ] in most English varieties.

* Only varieties with raising of /aɪ/.

For me, [oj] is a diphthong.

[Man in Space]

Something I kind of realized the other day: For me, tool and tulle are not homonyms. Tool has two syllables whereas tulle has one. Is this common? Does anyone else do this?

[Rounin Ryuuji]

Something I kind of realized the other day: For me, tool and tulle are not homonyms. Tool has two syllables whereas tulle has one. Is this common? Does anyone else do this?

Given that I've been using a semi-reading-pronunciation /tjuːl/ for "tulle", I also don't pronounce them as homophones. They can both be either monosyllables or disyllables, depending on the context in which they're spoken, though...

[jal]

Have I been pronouncing cases wrong? I've been saying (mostly in my head because I seldom need to actually speak about noun declensions) things like allative as [ə.ˈlɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] and locative as [loʊ̯.ˈkʰɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] (the same first two syllables as location).

Double wrong on locative, it seems. I did have the (correct) initial stress, but according to Wiktionary, it also has LOT: /ˈlɒkətɪv/, where I assumed GOAT, like you. <allative> is /ˈælətɪv/ (I at least had that one correct).


JAL

[Jonlang]

Have I been pronouncing cases wrong? I've been saying (mostly in my head because I seldom need to actually speak about noun declensions) things like allative as [ə.ˈlɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] and locative as [loʊ̯.ˈkʰɛɪ̯.tʰɪv] (the same first two syllables as location).

Double wrong on locative, it seems. I did have the (correct) initial stress, but according to Wiktionary, it also has LOT: /ˈlɒkətɪv/, where I assumed GOAT, like you. <allative> is /ˈælətɪv/ (I at least had that one correct).

It had never occured to me before, but I had watched a YouTube video on Latin noun declensions by an American guy and I was thrown by his pronunciation of the case names, I wasn't sure if this was an American pronunciation thing or if I had gotten it completely wrong, but as someone else pointed out I had been pronouncing things like nominative, accusative, genitive correctly. However, these correct pronunciations still don't sit right with me

[Travis B.]

How do you pronounce hydrogen? Especially, what is the first vowel in it, and are the first two syllables the same as in hydroelectric or hydroponic or like?

[bradrn]

How do you pronounce hydrogen? Especially, what is the first vowel in it, and are the first two syllables the same as in hydroelectric or hydroponic or like?

I have [ˈɦɑi̯d͡ʒʷɻʷəd͡ʒən], and as far as I can remember everyone I know has something similar to that. (Which is a fairly big sample, given that I’ve been doing chemistry for some time now.) The first two syllables are precisely the same as those in hydroelectric, hydroponic etc. [EDIT: correction, hydroponic is different in its second syllable.]