Triscriptal alchemical German
Triscriptal alchemical German
So it used to be common in western Europe to use two different scripts to represent different languages. Usually this was blackletter for Germanic languages and roman/antiqua for Latin or Romance languages. Here's an example from a grammar of Spanish:
The modern equivalent of this is using italics to indicate foreign words, although italics is now thought of as just "slanted letters" rather than a distinct script.
Alchemists had a large collection of symbols that they used to represent elements (and various other things). Most descriptions I've seen of this just call them "symbols" in a vague way without showing how they're actually used. The reality is they're logograms, used to represent words in text, in a way very similar to how kanji are used in Japanese:
Here <♁ij> represents antimonij, <🝭m> represents retortam, and <🝋erem> represents pulverem. (You probably don't have the fonts to render those last two, and if you do the glyphs probably aren't right.)
Now here's a German alchemical manuscript that combines both of these:
German words are written in Kurrent, while Latin words are written in roman (not sure if that's the correct name), including both unassimilated Latin phrases like <Materiam primam> and loanwords like <☿rial-> (= Mercurial-). Logograms are used for both German words (<das ☉> = das Gold) and Latin words (<☿rium 🝞atum> = mercurium sublimatum, in the image below).
There are also some words that combine all three scripts. In the second-last image in this post, the word Mercurial-Wasser is written with a logogram for Mercu-, roman for -rial-, and Kurrent for -Wasser. Similarly, at the bottom of the last image, the word sublimiren is written using a logogram for subli-, roman for -mir-, and Kurrent for -en.
I've never seen this kind of writing described before.
The modern equivalent of this is using italics to indicate foreign words, although italics is now thought of as just "slanted letters" rather than a distinct script.
Alchemists had a large collection of symbols that they used to represent elements (and various other things). Most descriptions I've seen of this just call them "symbols" in a vague way without showing how they're actually used. The reality is they're logograms, used to represent words in text, in a way very similar to how kanji are used in Japanese:
Here <♁ij> represents antimonij, <🝭m> represents retortam, and <🝋erem> represents pulverem. (You probably don't have the fonts to render those last two, and if you do the glyphs probably aren't right.)
Now here's a German alchemical manuscript that combines both of these:
German words are written in Kurrent, while Latin words are written in roman (not sure if that's the correct name), including both unassimilated Latin phrases like <Materiam primam> and loanwords like <☿rial-> (= Mercurial-). Logograms are used for both German words (<das ☉> = das Gold) and Latin words (<☿rium 🝞atum> = mercurium sublimatum, in the image below).
There are also some words that combine all three scripts. In the second-last image in this post, the word Mercurial-Wasser is written with a logogram for Mercu-, roman for -rial-, and Kurrent for -Wasser. Similarly, at the bottom of the last image, the word sublimiren is written using a logogram for subli-, roman for -mir-, and Kurrent for -en.
I've never seen this kind of writing described before.
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Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
This lools so cool
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
Fascinating find!
Roman script is upright and unjoined. I’d call it a variant of italic script, I think.
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Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
Seconded.
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
Thirded. Is there some sort of compilation or index of these manuscripts?
/j/ <j>
Ɂaləɂahina asəkipaɂə ileku omkiroro salka.
Loɂ ɂerleku asəɂulŋusikraɂə seləɂahina əɂətlahɂun əiŋɂiɂŋa.
Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ.
Ɂaləɂahina asəkipaɂə ileku omkiroro salka.
Loɂ ɂerleku asəɂulŋusikraɂə seləɂahina əɂətlahɂun əiŋɂiɂŋa.
Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ.
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
There's bibliographies of alchemical texts but I don't think there's a list of ones that are specifically written like this.
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
Here's another example of the same idea in print, with German in blackletter and Latin in antiqua:
<☿🜄> = Mercurial-Wasser, <componiret>
<philoſophiſche>, <antimonialiſchen>
<☿🜄> = Mercurial-Wasser, <componiret>
<philoſophiſche>, <antimonialiſchen>
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Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
What would make this better is if we could find one of these texts that also incorporates Tironian notes.
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
The only Tironian note I've ever seen used anywhere is ⁊.Glass Half Baked wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 5:54 pm What would make this better is if we could find one of these texts that also incorporates Tironian notes.
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
Sure, it may be the only one in modern usage, and then pretty much just in Ireland and Scotland, but are we just considering documents written recently?vlad wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 6:28 pmThe only Tironian note I've ever seen used anywhere is ⁊.Glass Half Baked wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 5:54 pm What would make this better is if we could find one of these texts that also incorporates Tironian notes.
Yaaludinuya siima d'at yiseka wohadetafa gaare.
Ennadinut'a gaare d'ate eetatadi siiman.
T'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa.
Ennadinut'a gaare d'ate eetatadi siiman.
T'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa.
Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
It's the only one I've seen used in the past 500 years.Travis B. wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 6:37 pmSure, it may be the only one in modern usage, and then pretty much just in Ireland and Scotland, but are we just considering documents written recently?vlad wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 6:28 pmThe only Tironian note I've ever seen used anywhere is ⁊.Glass Half Baked wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 5:54 pm What would make this better is if we could find one of these texts that also incorporates Tironian notes.
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Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
Go do it then.Glass Half Baked wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 7:51 pmLuckily, there is a solution to this problem here.
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Re: Triscriptal alchemical German
What texts are these examples from specifically?
Ye knowe eek that, in forme of speche is chaunge
With-inne a thousand yeer, and wordes tho
That hadden pris, now wonder nyce and straunge
Us thinketh hem; and yet they spake hem so,
And spedde as wel in love as men now do.
(formerly Max1461)
With-inne a thousand yeer, and wordes tho
That hadden pris, now wonder nyce and straunge
Us thinketh hem; and yet they spake hem so,
And spedde as wel in love as men now do.
(formerly Max1461)