Conlang fluency thread

[Imralu]

Where do you find these, by the way? Often I just look them up on Wiktionary, but at least cagilaba doesn’t seem to be there.

Nai zi myegi mu zywe dyi zyi a Vakaviti gwe Bisilama.
I just knew the Fijian and Bislama words.

Glosbe is pretty good. It's hard to get a big overview over everything at once like Wiktionary does, but it's often got entries in all kinds of languages, and if there aren't any dictionary entries, you can often still find words in the translation database if you're careful and analytical and don't mind wading through mounds of Jehovah's Witness propaganda.

Wiktionary is fucking awful sometimes. Do you look at the entry for "cyclone", "tropical cyclone", "typhoon" or "hurricane"? It's all sloppily done with these words. The distinction between these words is so arbitrary and stupid too.

Wi nge Hibu do, i ngini dye. Nginii ngi ya nini. Dyei dye. Ngini dyei ngini ye da ye dye.
In Hibuese, it's "ngini dye". A storm ("ngini") is an event ("ngi") of air ("nini"). A round thing ("dye") is round. A cyclone is a storm which is big and round.

(Also, you do know that Unicode ⟨ᵐ⟩ exists, right?)

Thanks! I had forgotten. I use https://ipa.typeit.org/full/, which has the audacity to call itself "full" simply because it's not restricted to English sounds. My IPA keyboard app on my phone also lacks most superscripts.

[bradrn]

Glosbe is pretty good. It's hard to get a big overview over everything at once like Wiktionary does, but it's often got entries in all kinds of languages, and if there aren't any dictionary entries, you can often still find words in the translation database if you're careful and analytical and don't mind wading through mounds of Jehovah's Witness propaganda.

OK, thanks!

(Also, you do know that Unicode ⟨ᵐ⟩ exists, right?)

Thanks! I had forgotten. I use https://ipa.typeit.org/full/, which has the audacity to call itself "full" simply because it's not restricted to English sounds. My IPA keyboard app on my phone also lacks most superscripts.

Usually I use SIL’s keyboard, which is pretty comprehensive.

(Well, actually I use a Linux port thereof, using my own software to generate it from the Windows version, but that‘s just details.)

[Imralu]

OK, thanks!

Hoi wa!
goodᴱ=COP 2S
You're welcome.

Usually I use SIL’s keyboard, which is pretty comprehensive.

(Well, actually I use a Linux port thereof, using my own software to generate it from the Windows version, but that‘s just details.)

Wai ho!
2S=COP goodᴱ
Thanks!

I vi u nai ndze haba ngozyo do mundo zyi.
COP badᴱ SIT 1S=COP RET.NEGᴱ suchᴱ boffin then know.wayᴬ GEN.3S
Unfortunately I'm not enough of a nerd to understand (how to use) it yet.

[xxx]

Ngoi mwe vwe mbya vavu nggoni.

d©b©¸„´<«¸-©¸b©¸/
(this thing named wind moving rapidly in a spiral shape...)
ok so whirling wind is a tornado....

Bo vwe vavu ngini dyei he zozwi lyuze.

d©·b©¸„«´¬<§D§[©
(this thing named many very wind moving and destroying all...)
cyclone would be bigger winds moving around and destroying everything...

[Tsimaah]

In Metin, expressed nominally or verbally, it would be

taxaasx hóoho
ta-xaasx hóoho

Code: Select all

ABS.FORM-storm whirl

Hurricane/Tornado
Or
ghumaɮi xaasx ut-hóoho
ghu-maɮ-i xaasx ut-hóoho

Code: Select all

in.image.of-outside-be.3 storm LOC.ABSTRACT whirl

There is a hurricane/tornado happening.

sxii yúunh ghumaɮi xaasx ut-hóoho taa áor sąbhaa?
sxii yúunh ghu-maɮ-i xaasx ut-hóoho taa áor s-ąbhaa

Code: Select all

 PLACE.LOC QUESTION in.image.of-outside-3 storm LOC.ABSTRACT spiral ABS.FORM CONCERN about.it-say.X 

Where was this cyclone people were talking about?

[Imralu]

(this thing named many very wind moving and destroying all...)
cyclone would be bigger winds moving around and destroying everything...

I ho u de zi lunai ndze ngwa zywe va.
COP goodᴱ SIT 3S RETᴱ here.1ᴱ=COP NEG.RETᴱ breakᴬ GEN.3P allᴱ
Fortunately, the one that was here didn't destroy everything.

I zi nwa vu mbya zwimba ye bidyu do byundu u gu bundu ye lu yo vumba nga.
COP RETᴱ oneᴱ part GEN.oneᴱ roof ATTR detach(INTR)ᴬ then fallᴬ SIT hitᴬ footpath ATTR LOCᴱ face apartment GEN.1S
One piece of a roof came off and crashed down onto the footpath in front of my apartment.

Mye u ndye mba zywe ngozye nga do, i bawe vyara bara ye byundu u dwei ba danyo u gii na.
but SIT nearᴱ house GEN.3P parent GEN.1S TOP | COP manyᴱ tree hugeᴱ ATTR fallᴬ SIT extremeᴱ oldᴱ SIT mildᴱ=COP 1S
Near my parents' place though, there were a lot of huge trees that came down that were older than me.

Nai ga zomba zywe wi gyanye.
1S=COP FUTᴱ go.homeᴬ GEN.3P SIT=COP current.daytime
I'm going to visit them today.

[Imralu]

sxii yúunh ghumaɮi xaasx ut-hóoho taa áor sąbhaa?
sxii yúunh ghu-maɮ-i xaasx ut-hóoho taa áor s-ąbhaa

Code: Select all

 PLACE.LOC QUESTION in.image.of-outside-3 storm LOC.ABSTRACT spiral ABS.FORM CONCERN about.it-say.X 

Where was this cyclone people were talking about?

I lu Bwiziba lu Qoselya.
COP LOCᴱ Brisbane LOCᴱ Australia
Brisbane, Australia.

[Imralu]

taxaasx hóoho
ta-xaasx hóoho

Code: Select all

ABS.FORM-storm whirl

Hurricane/Tornado

The only benefit I can see in putting your gloss in code tags is that it allows you to line up your gloss to the morphemes, like this:

Code: Select all

i   ho    u   de zi   luna   =i   ndze     ngwa   zywe   va.
COP goodᴱ SIT 3S RETᴱ here.1ᴱ=COP NEG.RETᴱ breakᴬ GEN.3P allᴱ

If you're not doing that, all it does is disrupt the flow. I was having trouble locating where one of your examples started and ended because the code boxes make these huge divisions.

[hwhatting]

I'm going to visit them today.

Fau ta patormátoru tai fau ta darwa fau uffai?
or-INT ART-N.PL parents-ACC 2SG-DAT or-INT ART-N.PL tree-PL.ACC or-INT both-N.ACC
Your parents or the trees or both ?

[Imralu]

I'm going to visit them today.

Fau ta patormátoru tai fau ta darwa fau uffai?
or-INT ART-N.PL parents-ACC 2SG-DAT or-INT ART-N.PL tree-PL.ACC or-INT both-N.ACC
Your parents or the trees or both ?

Ndzwa ya lo zombai lo zo mba.
meaning GEN situation go.homeᴬ=COP situation goᴬ house
The meaning of "lo zomba" (to visit) is "lo zo" (to go to) "mba" (house).

Ndyara vyarai nggwemba.
majority tree=COP houselessᴱ
Most trees don't have houses.

Myei ndwa do, nde zyu gyazii nyo zyu nai zomba zywe ngozye ngai lo dyonde vye vu mbya lyambye bwo u ye dyu vyara ye gi dzongwa.
but=COP AFFᴱ TOP | goal GEN.SR previous.daytime=COP time GEN.SR 1S=COP go.home GEN.3P parent GEN.1S=COP situation obtainᴬ GEN.PL part GEN.oneᴱ Epipremnum.pinnatum foreignᴱ SIT ATTR touchᴬ tree ATTR mildᴱ brokenᴱ
But, to tell the truth, the reason why I visited my parents today in particular was to get cuttings of a Monstera that's on a partially broken tree.

Do nenge woi gi ndwa.
thus language.produced GEN.2S=COP mildᴱᴬ AFFᴱ
So what you said is kind of true.

[Tsimaah]

The only benefit I can see in putting your gloss in code tags is that it allows you to line up your gloss to the morphemes, like this:

Code: Select all

i   ho    u   de zi   luna   =i   ndze     ngwa   zywe   va.
COP goodᴱ SIT 3S RETᴱ here.1ᴱ=COP NEG.RETᴱ breakᴬ GEN.3P allᴱ

If you're not doing that, all it does is disrupt the flow. I was having trouble locating where one of your examples started and ended because the code boxes make these huge divisions.

o'oó mí'yą zhįghumea tláng ut-[code], ziiąhit

Code: Select all

o'oó     mí'yą      zhį-   ghu-        m-   ea   tláng ut-      [code], zii'- ąhit
like.you UNDERSTAND useful-in.image.of-PERF-do.2 write FORM.LOC-[code] good-  say.2>1

I finally understand how to properly use the [code] blocks now, thank you.

ęęháanh sxii'Ąmérįką lįgįį ąbhakx'áá fiun ta-"Hurricane" háál lágo ghu'ąbhaa taxaasx hóoho maɮi sxii'o'tin Įtlę́ntįx ,

Code: Select all

ęęháanh sxii-    'Ąmérįką lįgįį    ąbhakx'áá  fiun  ta-              "Hurricane" háál        lágo     ghu-        'ąbhaa  
CURIOUS PLACE.LOC-America AT.LEAST say.X>1p   teach FORM.ABS-        "Hurricane" ON.ONE.HAND CONTRAST in.image.of-say.X

ta-          xaasx hóoho maɮ-    i ta-      'o'tin Įtlę́ntįx
ABSTRACT.ABS-storm whirl outside-3 PLACE.LOC-ocean Atlantic

It's interesting to me that, at least in America, they teach us that a "hurricane" is what happens in the Atlantic,

ta-"Cyclone" en' sxii'o'tin Pąsį́fįx eek'ens.

Code: Select all

ta-      "Cyclone" en' sxii-   'o'tin Pąsį́fįx eek'ens
FORM.ABS-"Cyclone" BUT FORM.ABS-ocean Pacific south

Whereas a "Cyclone" is what happens in the South Pacific

gá' ut-"Hurricane" háál lágo ghu'ą oa'Ąmérįkątin, ut-"Cyclone" oa'Ǫshchéíliątin.

Code: Select all

gá'       ut-      "Hurricane" háál        lágo     ghu-        ą     oa-       'Ąmérįkątin
DIFFERENT FORM.LOC-"Hurricane" ON.ONE.HAND CONTRAST in.image.of-say.3 PEOPLE.ABS-Americans

ut-      "Cyclone" oa-       'Ǫshchéíliątin
FORM.LOC-"Cyclone" PEOPLE.ABS-Australians

Rather than saying, "Cyclone" is the Australian word for a hurricane.

[Imralu]

o'oó mí'yą zhįghumea tláng ut-[code], ziiąhit

Code: Select all

o'oó     mí'yą      zhį-   ghu-        m-   ea   tláng ut-      [code], zii'- ąhit
like.you UNDERSTAND useful-in.image.of-PERF-do.2 write FORM.LOC-[code] good-  say.2>1

I finally understand how to properly use the [code] blocks now, thank you.

Hoi wa.
You're welcome.

Wai ze bahe no hwi lye u dyoi code tag. Ha wai dzuhi do, i lyuze ye ze nehe.
You don't have to give code tags a new line. If you do, it results in an unnecessary space.

ęęháanh sxii'Ąmérįką lįgįį ąbhakx'áá fiun ta-"Hurricane" háál lágo ghu'ąbhaa taxaasx hóoho maɮi sxii'o'tin Įtlę́ntįx ,

Code: Select all

ęęháanh sxii-    'Ąmérįką lįgįį    ąbhakx'áá  fiun  ta-              "Hurricane" háál        lágo     ghu-        'ąbhaa  
CURIOUS PLACE.LOC-America AT.LEAST say.X>1p   teach FORM.ABS-        "Hurricane" ON.ONE.HAND CONTRAST in.image.of-say.X

ta-          xaasx hóoho maɮ-    i ta-      'o'tin Įtlę́ntįx
ABSTRACT.ABS-storm whirl outside-3 PLACE.LOC-ocean Atlantic

It's interesting to me that, at least in America, they teach us that a "hurricane" is what happens in the Atlantic,

ta-"Cyclone" en' sxii'o'tin Pąsį́fįx eek'ens.

Code: Select all

ta-      "Cyclone" en' sxii-   'o'tin Pąsį́fįx eek'ens
FORM.ABS-"Cyclone" BUT FORM.ABS-ocean Pacific south

Whereas a "Cyclone" is what happens in the South Pacific

gá' ut-"Hurricane" háál lágo ghu'ą oa'Ąmérįkątin, ut-"Cyclone" oa'Ǫshchéíliątin.

Code: Select all

gá'       ut-      "Hurricane" háál        lágo     ghu-        ą     oa-       'Ąmérįkątin
DIFFERENT FORM.LOC-"Hurricane" ON.ONE.HAND CONTRAST in.image.of-say.3 PEOPLE.ABS-Americans

ut-      "Cyclone" oa-       'Ǫshchéíliątin
FORM.LOC-"Cyclone" PEOPLE.ABS-Australians

Rather than saying, "Cyclone" is the Australian word for a hurricane.

Dyi u ndzwai i hi longi u lu valyui tropical cyclone.
The term for this phenomenon wherever it occurs is "tropical cyclone"

Wi nge Nggilisyi do, ngi ye a lu vu ngya zyi Atilandi gwe lu vu ndyungya u zyi Zwara Dizoi nedyi hurricane.
In English, instances in the north Atlantic and northeast Pacific are named hurricanes.

Ngi ye lu lwangya zyi Zwara Dizoi nedyi typhoon.
Instances in the northwest Pacific are named typhoons.

Nibyai ze ya zyange vubu (u ndui yui mwendwa li u ndoi hina). Nanai ze zyebya dyi Hurricane Katrina u dei li Cyclone Katrina.
The difference is not dialectal (although it probably started off as such). We don't change the name of Hurricane Katrina to Cyclone Katrina.

Hurricane Katrinai tropical cyclone ye lu vu ngya zyi Atilandi, dozyei hurricane.
Hurricane Katrina was a tropical cyclone in the north Atlantic, so it was a hurricane.

U lu valyu bya do, dei (tropical) cyclone u myegi.
Elsewhere, they're just (tropical) cyclones.

Wi nge go vagya do, nana Qoselyai ze nge tropical, mye u ndui dyina do, cyclonei nwandzwa u zyei yu dyi cyclonei ze nezwe u ndzwai he low pressure system ye bya. Wanai myegi nge low u haze low pressure system.
Informally, in Australia, we don't say "tropical", but "cyclone" is still unambiguous because we don't use the word "cyclone" for other low pressure systems. We just call them "lows" or "low pressure systems".

U lye do, nanai ze banggwa zwe dyi storm u ndzwai he vavu low pressure system. Nai zyu stormi ngini ngga.
We also don't generally use the word "storm" for an entire low pressure system. To me, a storm is a thunderstorm.

U nai limwe nge Dyamani do, nai zi he limu zywe hi false friends:
When I was learning German, I had to learn these false friends:

storm ≠ Sturm
storm = Gewitter
Sturm = strong wind

[bradrn]

o'oó mí'yą zhįghumea tláng ut-[code], ziiąhit

Code: Select all

o'oó     mí'yą      zhį-   ghu-        m-   ea   tláng ut-      [code], zii'- ąhit
like.you UNDERSTAND useful-in.image.of-PERF-do.2 write FORM.LOC-[code] good-  say.2>1

I finally understand how to properly use the [code] blocks now, thank you.

[gloss]-naŋwafwe ni rwompes te sera:
[gloss]-naŋ·wa·fwe ni ∅-rw·o·ŋ-pes te sera
[gloss]-AGT·call FOC 3s-has-BEN this also

There is also the dedicated [gloss] tag:

o'oó

like.you

mí'yą

UNDERSTAND

zhį-

useful-

ghu-

in.image.of-

m-

PERF-

ea

do.2

tláng

write

ut-

FORM.LOC-

[code],

[code]

zii'-

good-

ąhit

say.2>1

(You can generate them at https://neonnaut.neocities.org/glossmygloss if you want.)

[xxx]

Wi nge go vagya do, nana Qoselyai ze nge tropical, mye u ndui dyina do, cyclonei nwandzwa u zyei yu dyi cyclonei ze nezwe u ndzwai he low pressure system ye bya. Wanai myegi nge low u haze low pressure system.

j¾j¯5¯V±¯Vj¯k¯ÃjÀS
(my word having to see having to understand (it) to say without listening old words...)
in 3SDL, it is about seeing the case in question, understanding it in order to name it, without taking into account other uses...