Some things I've noticed about my own reactions to works of fiction

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Raphael
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Some things I've noticed about my own reactions to works of fiction

Post by Raphael »

I have the impression that I react to works of fiction quite differently from many other people, in the sense that I don't mind some things that, for many other people, mean that a work is clearly poorly written, and, at the same time, things that many other people don't mind or even quite like are dealbreakers for me.

For instance, I don't mind it if some of the characters in a work aren't all that complex, if some of them can be summed up very quickly. Complex, multifaceted characters are nice to have, but for me it's not a requirement that all the characters have to be like that.

Related to that, I don't always mind clichés, and I might actively like clichés that push my buttons in just the right ways.

I'm also apparently hard to bore. OK, there should be more happening in a work of fiction than in the phonebook, but for me, it doesn't have to be an unbroken chain of excitement, either.

So simple plotlines and simple characters aren't automatically a problem for me, though things can go too far in that direction even for me. But the only concrete example I can think of for fiction I disliked for having simplistic plots, one-dimensional characters, unimpressive prose, and banal messages is the work of that celebrated icon of 20th-century German literature, Bertold Brecht. (Yes, I know that Brecht had come up with a new Theory of Theatre according to which simplistic plots, one-dimensional characters, unimpressive prose, and banal messages were features, not bugs, but I'm not impressed with that Theory of Theatre, either.)

Finally, I don't even really care as much about something as basic as plot as many others. If I like a scene in a book on its own, I don't see why I should care that much about whether that scene does anything for the larger plot.

At the same time, I do very much dislike it if I just can't stand a character whom I'm apparently supposed to cheer on, if I absolutely can't emphasize with any of the characters, or if the difference between my own worldview and priorities and the worldview and priorities of the writer(s) is just too big.

That doesn't mean that I have too completely agree with the writer. I quite like Richard Adams's Watership Down although I disagree with the novel's conservative politics, and Terry Pratchett's Jingo is one of my favorite books although I disagree with the pacifist message that is the whole point of the story. And given my somewhat idiosyncratic political views, if I'd insist on agreeing completely with authors whose work I read, I probably couldn't read anything.

But, that said, if I have the impression that a work expects me to cheer on things that I simply don't find cheer-on worthy, I can lose patience quickly. For instance, I once got Ray Bradbury's The Martian Chronicles as a present. I read the first few pages. Then, a character with whom the author seemed to agree seriously presented the old "if you explain the physics, chemistry, and biology of how people can see things, you're denying the beauty of beautiful paintings"-argument, without anyone pushing back against it. I consider that argument to be completely ridiculous, so I simply stopped reading the book at that point.

Another example is that I don't care how much of an amazing cinematographic genius Quentin Tarantino is; I simply can't stand his constant glorification of sadists and sociopaths, so I don't like his movies.

So, all in all, stuff that ruins fiction for seemingly everyone else is no problem for me, but stuff that is no problem for seemingly everyone else can ruin fiction for me. I sometimes wonder why that is so. I guess it's possible that I'm a bit on the spectrum - could that be a factor there? I don't know.
Last edited by Raphael on Wed Apr 02, 2025 10:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
rotting bones
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Re: Some things I've noticed about my own reactions to works of fiction

Post by rotting bones »

You don't have to care too much about what other people think. If you're open to simulating interest, I've recently turned to divination to write fiction like Philip K Dick. Here's one method I tried:

I got the Alice in Wonderland oracle deck and the Magickal Botanical oracle deck. I chose these decks for their themes and artwork.

I picked 8 effects of trauma: 1. Sensitivity, 2. Inattention, 3. Obsession, 4. Depression, 5. Anger, 6. Panic, 7. Guilt, and 8. Dissociation.

For each effect, I drew an Alice card to indicate the nature of the wound and a Botanical oracle to indicate the "medicine", i.e. the character arc that would serve as treatment.

It sort of worked, but the medicine deck has too many cards that tell you to reconnect with ancestors, spirits, the earth, etc. So I did some creative interpretations like psychics are supposed to. Here's an example:

1. Sensitivity

Wound: 13. All Must Have Prizes. Trying to keep everyone happy. Treating everyone as equals and rewarding those who have not worked hard. Playing nice, wanting to please. An inability to choose who or what is best for you. Trying to be fair, but avoiding difficult decisions is not fair on yourself. Maintaining illusions to avoid disappointing others.
Medicine: 6. Cannabis Reversed. We might be feeling lost or adrift and need some structure to balance an excess of dissolution. We must find our own center in the midst of the streams of life and establish our sense of self without slipping into fear.

2. Inattention

Wound: 14. Clock Time. You are distracted because of increased responsibility, feeling it is too late to pursue your dreams.
Medicine: 2. Belladonna Reversed. What spell are you under? What has enchanted you or distracted you? What might be toxic to you, but you haven't realized it yet? What messages from the spirit world are right there, but being ignored by you?

3. Obsession

Wound: 8. Do Not Drink Poison. Toxic nutrition or health regime. Clean out from your home and pantry of substances, foods, even fabrics that can 'poison' your personal environment.
Medicine: 15. Lavender Reversed. We may be acting too calm, too peaceful, not seeing things as they truly are, but as we want them to be. Get clarity from Lavender to see the situation truly, and then approach the work before you calmly, but realistically.

4. Depression

Wound: 42. Mortality Reversed. The belief that this life has less value than other possible lives. Wasting time, procrastinating or stagnating. Waiting for a 'heaven.' Believing life is more a curse than a blessing... a burden to be carried.
Medicine: 31. Yarrow Reversed. A violation of our boundaries and a need to seal up the wound, re-establishing protection shields. If the episode is not clear in your mind, reflect on recent communication and interactions, how someone might have crossed a line or contributed to your loss of energy. Is there a person or situation you are obsessing over? That could be your key. Take this time to re-establish your own personal space and be careful who you let into your space, mind and heart.

5. Anger

Wound: 43. Manage To Be Glad Reversed. A belief that happiness is easier for others who seem more fortunate and have been given blessings you have missed out on. Feeling happiness is out of reach. Focusing on the sadness, rather than the bliss that can be created.
Medicine: 12. Henbane Reversed. A block to your ancestral inheritance and inspiration. You are missing a part of the picture and need a fuller scope to proceed clearly. Uncover the truth.

6. Panic

Wound: 44. You Can't Go Back To Yesterday Reversed. Living in the past. Speaking of past events. Musing over what once was. Nostalgia. Believing you are the same as you once were. Living through stories rather than experiences. Memory overrides the present. No anticipation of future.
Medicine: 5. Camellia. Appreciate what you have-your home, belongings, health and happiness. When this card appears in a reading, it indicates gratitude for what you have and reminds you that gratitude combined with humility is the key to going forward. The flower spirit is enveloped in the luxury of her petals. Enjoy the world and your life. Enjoy your family and friends. Listen to your intuition from a place of beauty and security. Do not fear scarcity.

7. Guilt

Wound: 25. Wake Up! A rude awakening. Being asked to deliver before you feel ready.
Medicine: 14. Ivy Reversed. Are you feeling uprooted and ungrounded? Are the difficulties of life making it hard to go on? Ivy tells us to root ourselves in the world once again to be able to grow and thrive rather than give up. You will develop the strength and resilience needed to go onward.

8. Dissociation

Wound: 26. It's Always Teatime. You feel deadened by the repetition in patterns and schedules.
Medicine: 4. Calla Lily. The balance of desire and spiritual attainment is found. Strive for personal empowerment, or a relationship going well on all levels, a match physically and spiritually. Things should be pleasurable, peaceful and connected.
rotting bones
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Re: Some things I've noticed about my own reactions to works of fiction

Post by rotting bones »

I wrote a script to do this automatically with LLaMA: https://github.com/thoriumrobot/narrative So many typos. :(

Sample output:
Character 1:
1. Sensitivity
Wound: Such a Curious Dream Reversed. Venting to hold on to an experience and not return to the everyday. Wishing to live in Wdnderland rather than experiencing it and bringing its magick into your everyday world. Becoming ungrounded and disconnected. Feeling drawn to fantasy. Being susceptible to illusions.
Medicine: Holly. The Holly King looks coldly at you, attired in his winter regalia. You need protection from outside forces. Look for clues on how to approach your protection in a just and balanced manner.
Context: IX of Swords: Cruelty. Aggression, Lack of compassion, Inflicting pain, Shame, Guilt.

2. Inattention
Wound: Who in the World Are You? Reversed. Believing you know just who you are. Certain of identity. Refusing to question yourself Believing you are fixed and unchanging. Going along with the main current of who you are supposed to be. Feeling comfortable with who you believe yourself to be, but ultimately limiting your potential because of this.
Medicine: Hemlock. By paying attention to dreams or nightmares, you have an opportunity to get unstuck and move through anything that's stopping you. The inner voice and intuitive message create the key for you to bypass anything that keeps you stuck and get going on your evolution without delay. The noxious root stares directly at us, and we cannot avert our gaze. Face the situation head on.
Context: VI of Chalices: Pleasure. Healing, Rtion, Pleasure after hardship, Moving away from old wounds.

3. Obsession
Wound: Nature Communication. You are being asked not to make assumptions. Be open to possibilities that seem to be outside rational expectation. Attempts to communicate with beings from other realms - within nature, spiritual planes or even just humans it is thought there is no chance of speaking to or being understood by. Be open and express the desire for communication. Be more lateral and less literal about the ways communication can take place. Be a being worth communicating with - this will go far!
Medicine: Rue. We need protection and blessing even if things appear to be going well. Forces are working against us. Bring in more light and take precaution so no harm might befall us or our loved ones. Vervain represents protection blessings, healing, love and peace. The key of mysteries represents the gates we believe are locked to us. The waxing crescent Moon indicates slow and steady growth of good thing. The dagger represents protection and truth. The rooster head symbolizes vigilance and guardianship.
Context: Chariot. Success. Victory over past obstructions, Movement towards goals, Conquering.

4. Depression
Wound: You Are Rare and Free Reversed. Conforming may seem like the answer, as may disguising all that makes you different. You may be attempting to be like others and allowing yourself to be told who you ought to be. Consider being your own best friend and celebrating your differences!
Medicine: Garden. Reception of information and manifestation as an act of creation. What seeds do you tend in your spirit? Transformation, gentleness, breaking illusions and the great work. Anchoring intentions, manifest willpower.
Context: III of Chalices: Abundance. Happiness in groups, Joyful social life, Sharing happiness with friends, Pleasure.

5. Anger
Wound: The Right Way. Wanting to get through to the other side of a situation. A desire to walk through a gateway or a life transition, to become an 'insider' rather than remaining on the periphery. Wanting to have an impact, to be included, to be a part of the activities and have an influence on the world. A willingness to learn, step by step.
Medicine: Wolfsbane Reversed. Terror. An uncontrollable desire to run away from confrontation or escape by becoming someone or something else. What are you running from? What fear are you being forced to confront? Learn courage, for it is only by facing fear that the next step will become apparent, not by avoiding it.
Context: Moon. Feeling lost, Loss of clarity, Deception, Secrets, Hidden Truths.

6. Panic
Wound: Changed in the Night Reversed. Feeling you are not growing as a person or that you have stayed the same for a very long time. You may be looking at introducing some new and exciting challenges into your life to help you grow and discover more about all the wonderful selves you have within you.
Medicine: Fly Agaric. An opportunity to make contact with a deeper level of awareness, catalyzing your creativity and healing. You must be willing to risk being perceived as foolish or crazy, and also take time to listen in order to learn. Reconnect with craftiness, speed and fertility, transformation or love and good fortune.
Context: Prince of Wands. Speed, Activity, Impulsiveness, Generosity.

7. Guilt
Wound: You Can't Go Back to Yesterday. You are more than your past. You have evolved and changed. Sharing your history is only to share who you once were. You are no longer the same person.
Medicine: Thistle. Stand in your nobility and assert your power. Stand tall for justice. Exhibit quiet strength and deal with the situation with confidence and security. When two hearts are united in one cause, they are crowned and multiply in strength and power.
Context: Aeon. Awakening, Rebirth, Renewal, Liberation, Revelation.

8. Dissociation
Wound: Law is not Justice Reversed. Believing the law is right, under any circumstances. Accepting the judgement of a powerful person without question. Allowing yourself to be influenced without knowing the story. A deep bias, which is colouring your vision. A flawed filter through which you, or another, may be seeing the world. Take the time to think independently.
Medicine: Bleeding Heart. Reflect on unhealed wounds. Where do you hold on to grief or pain? What unhealthy attachments bind you? What needs to be released to move on with your life? Notice how that plant spirit turns her back, turning away from the past to let it go. Bleeding Heart tells you to seek catharsis, often through tears, as the drop is also evocative of tears cleansing the heart. Don't be afraid to cry to heal. Each of the heart-shaped flowers needs to crack and split open to bloom, to release the teardrop in order to heal.
Context: Magus. Willpower, Activity, Impulse, Self-direction, Manifestation.


---

Character 2:
1. Sensitivity
Wound: Belong to Your Own Dream. Finding you have been following a plan and a path that is not truly your own. Deciding to take steps to live in a way that is authentic and truly your own. Rebelling. Wishing to live in your own world. No longer making decisions, staying with people or in jobs that are not part of your dream. Not being directed or governed by the desires and dreams of others. Deciding to make some big changes toward following the path that is your souls true dream for its evolution this lifetime.
Medicine: Belladonna Reversed. What spell are you under? What has enchanted you or distracted you? What might be toxic to you, but you haven't realized it yet? What messages from the spirit world are right there, but being ignored by you?
Context: Princess of Wands. Courage, Excitement, Free spirit, Love of life.

2. Inattention
Wound: All in the Golden Afternoon Reversed. Feeling Dull, uninspired, mundane. Believing you lack creativity. Dissatisfaction with your work. Negative self-talk.
Medicine: Garden Reversed. What isn't clearly planted in your life? What has been uprooted? What is unbalanced? Which powers misaligned? Replant your garden.
Context: VI of Chalices: Pleasure. Healing, Rtion, Pleasure after hardship, Moving away from old wounds.

3. Obsession
Wound: You Can't Go Back to Yesterday Reversed. Living in the past. Speaking of past events. Musing over what once was. Nostalgia. Believing you are the same as you once were. Living through stories rather than experiences. Memory overrides the present. No anticipation of the future.
Medicine: Dandelion Reversed. You are holding on to anger or poison and need to purge. What is preventing you from moving forward and shining? What toxicity are you holding onto internally, any why? Learn to release it.
Context: Art. Alchemy, Fusion, To combine and create.

4. Depression
Wound: Mortality. Appreciation of existence. Relishing being alive. Making the most of every moment. Accepting mortality in ourselves and in others. Living in the present. Feeling joy at being alive.
Medicine: Dragon Tree. You are called to draw forth your natural power and take action as necessary. Express your will. Take flight. It is time to be active and make things happen in inner or outer worlds, but you cannot remain idle. While the Dragon Tree can have an aggressive nature, you are not necessarily called to be aggressive, but confident and strong. The Dragon Tree tells you not to be passive, but to take an active role in shaping your life.
Context: III of Wands: Virtue. Constructive use of energy, Openness, Honesty.

5. Anger
Wound: Growing Up Reversed. Hanging on to youth at all costs. Denying the existence of change as we grow older. Being stuck in a habit of our youth. Wishing to be young again. Feeling you have learned very little, although you are growing older. Seeing maturation only as a process of deterioration. Concern about your fate as you grow older.
Medicine: Sorcerer's Violet. Reaching, striving and opening up while remaining grounded, centered and true to our past. Explore, but don't forget where you come from. Take reasonable precautions and be aware of subtle forces around you.
Context: VI of Disks: Success. Generosity, Understanding true value of things.

6. Panic
Wound: I Want to Be a Queen Reversed. Fear of your power. A preference for being told what to do rather than deciding what is best for you. Acquiescing to another s will. Seeing power as a corrupting influence. Shrinking away from potential. Fear of failure. Over-compromising.
Medicine: Mandrake. Seek mystery in hidden and dark places, embracing who we really are. Ask yourself how you are using your gifts. We have the power to bless, curse and offer protection.
Context: Queen of Swords. Wisdom, Open-mindedness, Perception, Fairness.

7. Guilt
Wound: Clock Time Reversed. Refusing to meet a deadline. Procrastination and avoidance. Feeling overwhelmed with responsibility. Giving up on dreams. Making no progress. Being too slow. Staying still when movement is needed.
Medicine: Willow. The leaping frog is a totem of transformation. The dragonfly signifies the shattering of illusions. The bees symbolize industry. The urn is the awareness of life and death.We need to be flexible by bending, changing and adapting to circumstances. Take steps to ease our pain and suffering. Do not become adamant in perspectives and feelings.
Context: Knight of Swords. Science, Intellect, Logic, Theory.

8. Dissociation
Wound: Choices. Choosing which way to go. A moment of decision. Uncertain of what is best or what to do next. Feeling like each door is closed. Wanting to reach the next stage of life but not seeing a single way through.
Medicine: Rose. Seek love, beauty and harmony. As above, so below rises crowned in divine knowledge. Feel your heartbeat and sense creation spreading above, below and around it. Find beauty in yourself and in all creation. Look for opportunities for true, divine love in your present situation. You need to open yourself.
Context: Fortune. Cycles, Constant change, Fate, Acceptance, Movement with change.


**Character Descriptions:**

Character 1 (from first passage):
This character is struggling with feelings of nostalgia and being stuck in the past. They have a deep appreciation for life, but are grappling with their own mortality. They may come across as introspective and philosophical.

Character 2 (from second passage):
This character has a fear of losing youth and growing older. They deny change and cling to habits from their younger years. They may appear anxious and concerned about their future.

**Interpersonal Event 1:**

A group outing to an art museum, where Character 1 is inspired by the creativity on display and begins to share their own nostalgic stories. Character 2 becomes increasingly agitated as they feel uncomfortable with the focus on aging and mortality.

Character 1 sees this as a catalyst for growth and reflection, and starts to open up about their fears of growing old. They begin to question whether it's possible to hold onto youth while still embracing life's changes.

Character 2 interprets this event as a reminder of their own worst fears: being trapped in a body that no longer reflects their youthful vitality. They become withdrawn and isolated, convinced that they're losing control.

**Interpersonal Event 2:**

A chance encounter between Character 1 and Character 2 at a park, where Character 1 is drawn to the beauty of nature and begins to talk about the importance of living in the present moment. Character 2 becomes defensive, feeling judged by Character 1's words and perceiving them as trying to "force" growth.

Character 1 sees this as an opportunity for connection and understanding, hoping to help Character 2 see the value in embracing change. They share their own experiences with mortality and encourage Character 2 to confront their fears head-on.

Character 2 interprets this event as a threat to their sense of identity and security. They become increasingly paranoid, convinced that Character 1 is trying to "fix" them or undermine their youth.

**Interpersonal Event 3:**

A shared experience of crisis when both characters are caught in a sudden storm while walking together. As the wind howls and lightning flashes, Character 1 turns to Character 2 and asks if they're okay. Character 2 breaks down in tears, finally confronting their fears of aging and losing control.

Character 1 sees this as a moment of breakthrough and connection, feeling grateful for the shared experience that's allowed them to understand each other on a deeper level.

Character 2 interprets this event as a symbol of their own vulnerability and mortality. They begin to let go of their fear of aging, realizing that life is too short to be controlled by anxiety about the future.

These events highlight how different characters can interpret the same situation in vastly different ways, influenced by their unique traumas and perspectives.
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xxx
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Re: Some things I've noticed about my own reactions to works of fiction

Post by xxx »

The appeal of works of fiction is being able to experience another person's thoughts in another world...
what we find there isn't always pleasant or in line with our vision of the world,
and that's a good thing, that's the point...
It's by enriching our experience in this way that we develop a more complex way of thinking
that's capable of taking into account another way of thinking about the world...

Afterwards, we have to find our own benefit,
knowing that when we leave a story as we entered it, it's because we're dealing with a dispensable work,
and everyone finds more or less resonance with this or that aspect,
but conversely, certain encounters are too traumatic to be pursued alone...

literary criticism also serves to mark out these encounters...
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