Zompist Bboard Again

Karch wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 5:53 am

mi kue toeba. tɔŋkita eti kue taoebe. gi buɟejebiŋkɤbe. mi cɔgegantitebe. ekweɟalle abemoibe. ŋi maŋka ga aŋgibete belebe. inenegi kueilowabegi kuburaŋega. gi ecɛlletucebe. tɔŋkita gi tukiriaŋega kueitekwatebe. lua cilemegi ukitteɛge. ice gi nariɛleetaŋegirage. uemegi ɤŋgamameba bencame ati. onotagilelemba etiʔnde ati.

Here's a text, transcribed into the IPA.

OK, I guess you are doing the next text, then.

Now this one is interesting. There seem to be no fricatives, and plenty of stops. To me that suggests either Dravidian, Australian or Great Andamanese. But it can’t be Australian, as you have a voicing contrast. Can’t be Great Andamanese either, since I already did that one, and so I know it looks completely different. Yet it can’t be Dravidian either, since those languages don’t tend to have vowels like /ɤ/.

…OK, so let’s use PHOIBLE now, always a good guide when dealing with more interesting phonologies. Turns out that there’s quite a few more clusters of languages with no fricatives — a big one in the Amazon, and another smaller one in eastern Africa. Searching for both /ɟ/ and /ɤ/ also shows a bunch of Amazonian languages. So I’m going to guess: is this language from somewhere in the Amazon region?

(fusijui asked if we could go into a bit more detail about our conclusions, so I decided to do that here, which is why this post is a bit longer than normal.)

It isn't spoken in the Amazon.

Is it spoken in Asia?

Onge?

(no fricatives, a lot of vowels, very un-Nilotic structure so that's out, sentences that generally start with gi (Onge 3SG) and end in -be (Onge past tense/completive marker))

edit: yes, Dasgupta and Sharma 1982

An easy one and a hard one:

Umandu, mamakudaiti mata artiibadu i? Mamakudaitii asɨ tukuman naugara mamaannaga mamaffatu naaga ffatu saariikii, imnu munu turtii saariikii, mamaffaubaa utsɨni nivvasɨ - naaga ffaubaa utsɨni nivvasɨ - mamaffaubaa pukani nivvasii, mapadaatinu tukuman nivvasii utaryaa. Naagaffanu banna punitsɨkaiba nivvaintii aɨtaryaa, ttyaa vva kuman ttsii nivvi baga umanna nivvaditii, unu anigamaga kaii nivviutartsa. Kaii nivviutaryaa unu annaa ttsii, baa kamanna nivvasɨtaibatii baatti kirii, tooriikinkai doofti utusɨtartsa.

ap čaˀp aχtɛʰːŋ. xɛzdaŋ ɔʰːn čafɨr dʌ́χanaʰːbdi, fənʲadiŋ fɨčika dʌ́χanaʰːbdi. ap čip uk čipdiŋəːr dʌχtɨ dačattadagetʲ. daχɨn dašɔgejbata. at bobdaŋ aːs bajabɛʰːtʲ. ap bisɛˀp sitɔnɛχaːtʲkej ətn isou kɛˀt dʌŋade. u abaŋ kuadaχdiŋəːr, χak sɨkŋ uɔʰːnde. ab eiŋgej at abbačɔχɔn. bu at nʲɛnʲbetʲ dɛjčaddiʔ. u tɔˀn sim kɔʰːrdaχ. ətn daŋ dʌŋaden. beiŋ naŋəːr digbesoʰːrgen.

Nortaneous wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 8:01 pm Onge?

(no fricatives, a lot of vowels, very un-Nilotic structure so that's out, sentences that generally start with gi (Onge 3SG) and end in -be (Onge past tense/completive marker))

edit: yes, Dasgupta and Sharma 1982

And to think that I dismissed Andamanese languages so quickly earlier…

Nortaneous wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 8:42 pm An easy one and a hard one:

Umandu, mamakudaiti mata artiibadu i? Mamakudaitii asɨ tukuman naugara mamaannaga mamaffatu naaga ffatu saariikii, imnu munu turtii saariikii, mamaffaubaa utsɨni nivvasɨ - naaga ffaubaa utsɨni nivvasɨ - mamaffaubaa pukani nivvasii, mapadaatinu tukuman nivvasii utaryaa. Naagaffanu banna punitsɨkaiba nivvaintii aɨtaryaa, ttyaa vva kuman ttsii nivvi baga umanna nivvaditii, unu anigamaga kaii nivviutartsa. Kaii nivviutaryaa unu annaa ttsii, baa kamanna nivvasɨtaibatii baatti kirii, tooriikinkai doofti utusɨtartsa.

Dravidian? (Probably not, but I don’t have any other guesses right now.)

ap čaˀp aχtɛʰːŋ. xɛzdaŋ ɔʰːn čafɨr dʌ́χanaʰːbdi, fənʲadiŋ fɨčika dʌ́χanaʰːbdi. ap čip uk čipdiŋəːr dʌχtɨ dačattadagetʲ. daχɨn dašɔgejbata. at bobdaŋ aːs bajabɛʰːtʲ. ap bisɛˀp sitɔnɛχaːtʲkej ətn isou kɛˀt dʌŋade. u abaŋ kuadaχdiŋəːr, χak sɨkŋ uɔʰːnde. ab eiŋgej at abbačɔχɔn. bu at nʲɛnʲbetʲ dɛjčaddiʔ. u tɔˀn sim kɔʰːrdaχ. ətn daŋ dʌŋaden. beiŋ naŋəːr digbesoʰːrgen.

Is the aspirated vowels thing here some sort of nonstandard notation for breathy voice or something? I suspect so, given their use of ⟨č⟩. Anyway, I’m guessing that this is from North America.

bradrn wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 9:49 pm Dravidian? (Probably not, but I don’t have any other guesses right now.

no

Is the aspirated vowels thing here some sort of nonstandard notation for breathy voice or something? I suspect so, given their use of ⟨č⟩. Anyway, I’m guessing that this is from North America.

the vowel thing is unfortunately not made very clear in the source. it's not from North America

the first is some kind of Miyako, the second is Yeniseian. Ket?

I'll specifically guess Ikema Miyako and Kott.

Karch wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:03 am the first is some kind of Miyako, the second is Yeniseian.

yes

Ket?

no

Frislander wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 6:40 am I'll specifically guess Ikema Miyako and Kott.

no and no

I’ll guess Ōgami Miyako and Yugh?

Birdlang wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 5:21 am Ōgami Miyako

no

Yugh?

yes

Tarama Miyako?

Karch wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 10:47 amTarama Miyako?

no

I thought this would be the easy one. more text (with normalized transcription)

Tooriiketiidui, ssibara, maibara, satubɿtunu atarca. Fɨtakiv. Fɨtakiv ariutuidu, pɿtukivga imnu acca yaiba, unukyaa, pɿtukivnu pɿtunu ssibararu atarru maibararu atarru mmya ssansuga, pɿtukivnu... Fɨtakivkara pɿtukivnu pɿtunu yunai, ningyo, yunatamau tuiccii, kurusii, mmya uria ɿɿu yaiba, kurusii, katabataubaa yakii fai, katabataubaa yaanu panan nuusii, pusiatarca.

Is it Irabu Miyako then?

Karch wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 1:17 pm Is it Irabu Miyako then?

yes

Since I got one right and Karch got one right, I think we should each post one...

Then I got a confusing one in a non standard romanization.
Kabútar púre višva meñ páje džáne pálá pakši hé. Jah ek nijattápí, uřne pálá pakši hé džiská šarír paroñ se ďhaká rahtá hé. Muñh ke sján par iská čhoťí nukílí čoñč holí hé. Mukh do čañčuoñ se ghirá evañ džabďá dañt’hín hotá hé.

Birdlang wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 7:03 pm Since I got one right and Karch got one right, I think we should each post one...

I think that might be a bit too confusing.

Then I got a confusing one in a non standard romanization.
Kabútar púre višva meñ páje džáne pálá pakši hé. Jah ek nijattápí, uřne pálá pakši hé džiská šarír paroñ se ďhaká rahtá hé. Muñh ke sján par iská čhoťí nukílí čoñč holí hé. Mukh do čañčuoñ se ghirá evañ džabďá dañt’hín hotá hé.

Slavic?

Birdlang wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 7:03 pm Kabútar púre višva meñ páje džáne pálá pakši hé. Jah ek nijattápí, uřne pálá pakši hé džiská šarír paroñ se ďhaká rahtá hé. Muñh ke sján par iská čhoťí nukílí čoñč holí hé. Mukh do čañčuoñ se ghirá evañ džabďá dañt’hín hotá hé.

Indic? (Hindi?)

Birdlang wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 7:03 pmKabútar púre višva meñ páje džáne pálá pakši hé. Jah ek nijattápí, uřne pálá pakši hé džiská šarír paroñ se ďhaká rahtá hé. Muñh ke sján par iská čhoťí nukílí čoñč holí hé. Mukh do čañčuoñ se ghirá evañ džabďá dañt’hín hotá hé.

This is one of the weirder romanisations of Hindi I’ve seen. What’s the source?