Zompist Bboard Again

Lērisama wrote: ↑Sat Dec 21, 2024 10:35 am (simplified Yaazhgigzhoomnem?)

[…] if it had more valency reducers (let's say both el and oosh), I don't think the condition would be writable in the current version.

bradrn wrote: ↑Sat Dec 21, 2024 5:48 am

Lērisama wrote: ↑Sat Dec 21, 2024 4:44 am I have found a bug to report in brassica. Multivalent features seem not to word properly with the set operations

[…] I haven’t looked into the &&Str case. I can do so tomorrow.

As for &&Str, that’s not actually a bug: it’s a deliberate design decision. When there’s more than two features, there’s no one obvious way to arrange the features, so you could end up with unpredictable ordering in V. For this reason Brassica only supports the && syntax when there are two categories. (This is documented in the reference.)

bradrn wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2024 6:03 pm

bradrn wrote: ↑Sat Dec 21, 2024 5:48 am

Lērisama wrote: ↑Sat Dec 21, 2024 4:44 am I have found a bug to report in brassica. Multivalent features seem not to word properly with the set operations

[…] I haven’t looked into the &&Str case. I can do so tomorrow.

I have an explanation for this now. (Which I thought I posted already, but clearly didn’t.)

To quote myself from a GitHub issue where someone else reported this same problem:

As for &&Str, that’s not actually a bug: it’s a deliberate design decision. When there’s more than two features, there’s no one obvious way to arrange the features, so you could end up with unpredictable ordering in V. For this reason Brassica only supports the && syntax when there are two categories. (This is documented in the reference.)

categories
C = m n p t k b d g f s v z r l y w

+Str+None = a e i o u ə ɨ
+Str+Sec  = à è ì ò ù ə̀ ɨ̀
+Str+Pri  = á é í ó ú ? ?

V = +Str+None &+Str+Sec &+Str+Pri
; or V = &&Str - see below
end

-rtl -1 [+Str+None -ə -ɨ] / +Str+Pri
-rtl C* +Str+None C* +Str+None C* / C* +Str+Sec C* +Str+None C* / _ // ^+Str+Pri _

; dukɨtipəta → dùkɨtìpətá
; dukɨtipetə → dukɨ̀tipétə
; dukɨtipətə → dùkɨtípətə

Man in Space wrote: ↑Sun Jan 05, 2025 11:09 am Bug report:

Code: Select all

new categories
K = t̪ n̪ θ ð
L = t n s l
M = tʲ nʲ ʃ j
end

When I try to do [K L] / M / M _ (or any combination thereof; I'm going for stop assimilation), the output is "�". Using two rules (K / L / L _ and K / M / M _), it works fine.

bradrn wrote: ↑Sat Nov 30, 2024 8:10 am

Neonnaut wrote: ↑Sat Nov 30, 2024 5:26 am The Codemirror "Lezer" setup that does the syntax highlighting.

Ah! I didn’t use Lezer, actually — I just used regexps, defined here. Feel free to copy and use (with attribution, of course).

if (stream.match(/^new categories( nohighlight)?$/)) {
  state.categories = []
  state.cblock = true;
  return "keyword";
}
 if (stream.match(/^categories$/)) {
   state.cblock = true;
  return "keyword";
 }

if (stream.sol()){
	if (stream.match(/new categories( nohighlight)?$/)) {
		state.categories = []
        state.cblock = true;
        return "keyword";
    }
    if (stream.match(/categories$/)) {
		state.cblock = true;
		return "keyword";
	}
}

Neonnaut wrote: ↑Mon Jan 06, 2025 10:50 am I'm not sure if it's intentional or not, but but in Brassica Online you can put random letters before the "category" declaration but category will still be highlighted as if there is no error. I don't know why myself, but RegExp "^" doesn't work in StreamLanguage, but "stream.sol()" (start of line) does.

Lērisama wrote: ↑Wed Mar 05, 2025 10:51 am I have no idea how difficult it would be to compile an arm-compatible appimage, and I'm happy to build it myself if you can't/don't want to/it's particularly fun, but I thought I'd ask first.

bradrn wrote: ↑Wed Mar 05, 2025 6:53 pm

Lērisama wrote: ↑Wed Mar 05, 2025 10:51 am I have no idea how difficult it would be to compile an arm-compatible appimage, and I'm happy to build it myself if you can't/don't want to/it's particularly fun, but I thought I'd ask first.

The thought of attempting it gives me shivers up my spine. I mean, it’s probably possible, and I’m probably overestimating the difficulty, but I vaguely recall encountering some difficulties last time I tried to compile a Haskell program on a Raspberry Pi.

Lērisama wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 1:25 am

bradrn wrote: ↑Wed Mar 05, 2025 6:53 pm

Lērisama wrote: ↑Wed Mar 05, 2025 10:51 am I have no idea how difficult it would be to compile an arm-compatible appimage, and I'm happy to build it myself if you can't/don't want to/it's particularly fun, but I thought I'd ask first.

The thought of attempting it gives me shivers up my spine. I mean, it’s probably possible, and I’m probably overestimating the difficulty, but I vaguely recall encountering some difficulties last time I tried to compile a Haskell program on a Raspberry Pi.

I'll try it myself then. Be prepared for an inordinate number of questions (by PM?)

WarpedWartWars wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 1:23 pm How do I make a sound change to remove spaces?

Hyphens can however be treated as word separators (mother-in-law is pronounced like mother in law).

WarpedWartWars wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 8:43 am also, i'd like a way to specify a rule as applying except in any of multiple environments. e.g.:

Lērisama wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 10:05 am This already exists: your examples of y / i // V _ // _ V and a l k / ô k // # _ // _ u are wrong – you can't use the shortcut of not specifying an environment when you use an exception. The correct form for the latter is a l / ô / _ k // # _ // _ u. Which correctly transformed talk alk alku to tôk alk alku.

Lērisama wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 10:05 am For some reason the equivalent y / i / _ // V _ // _ V doesn't work for me: only the first exception is applied – I got kykyay → kikiay; this seems to be a real bug.

WarpedWartWars wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 5:07 am btw the reason i'm replying to my own two-and-a-half year old post is because i was reading through the Brassica docs yesterday and found this section, which is almost certainly exactly what i wanted

WarpedWartWars wrote: ↑Thu Mar 06, 2025 8:43 am on a different note, the Writing Sound Changes documentation file never once mentions // exception environment, with the one and only use of it being in an example in the section on featural categories, and even there, it says nothing about it. it seems like it should at least be mentioned in the prose of the section on conditional sound changes. it is mentioned in the reference manual, though, so at least there's that

also, i'd like a way to specify a rule as applying except in any of multiple environments.

another thing that'd be nice to have is a way to specify in the environment that an element be anything that isn't what's specified, like (using ≠ as an mockup symbol):

Code: Select all

t / d / ≠[# .] _ w

would turn ⟨tw⟩ into ⟨dw⟩ anywhere except for the very beginning of a syllable (i know you could use / _ w // [# .] _, but it's more compact and there are probably situations where it's far cleaner too, and in some situations it makes more sense to say "this spot can be anything that isn't X" than to say "this spot can be anything, but disregard that if this other thing that just happens to say this spot is X is the case")