Zompist Bboard Again

Posted: **Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:23 am**

thinking of creating a language that is related to Vrkhazhian:

Absolute State
    | FEM.SG  | FEM.PL    | MASC.SG | MASC.PL   |
NOM | -o      | -wən/-bən | -e      | -yən/-gən |
VOC | -u      | -wən/-bən | -i      | -yən/-gən |
ACC | -oš     | -wəš/-bəš | -eš     | -yəš/-gəš |
GEN |         |           |         |           |
INS | -ok     | -wək/-bək | -ek     | -yək/-gək |
LOC |         |           |         |           |

Construct State
    | COMM.SG | COMM.PL
NOM | -ə      | -a
VOC | -ə      | -a
ACC | -əš     | -aš
GEN |         |
INS | -ək     | -ak
LOC |         |

Feminine:
məzyo "sea" > məzibən "seas"
surğo "chicken" > surəğwən "chickens"
kʰurušo "boat" > kʰurušwən "boats"
əğto "boat" > əğətwən "boats"

Masculine:
ḥəzwe "boar" > ḥəzugən "boars"
tirme "slave" > tirimyən "slaves"

Posted: **Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:41 am**

Are some of those vowels mixed up?

Posted: **Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:47 am**

I see what you mean, oops.

Anyways, I am going for a general word/syllable-final /u i/ > /o e/, stressed vowel breaking of /u: i:/ > /wə jə/, all length is lost, and /a/ becomes /ə/.

But I do not know how closely related it will be to Vrkhazhian, because it still appears to be closely related morphologically. It could be within the same family, or from another family.

Comparison:

Code: Select all

English            | Unnamed Lang    | Written Vrkhazhian | Spoken Vrkhazhian
sea; seas          | məzyo; məzibən  | mazûm              | mazû
chicken; chickens  | surğo; surəğwən | surğum; surğūm     | surğu; surğū
boat; boats        | əğto; əğətwən   | ḳurūśum; ḳurūśūm   | ḳurūśu; ḳurūśū
boar; boars        | ḥəzwe; ḥəzugən  | ezîm               | ezî
slave; slaves      | tirme; tirimyən | tirmim; tirmīm     | tirmi; tirmī
human; humans      | ḫəbo; ḫəbwən    | lumbum; lumbūm     | lumbu; lumbū
beast; beasts      | habe; habyən    | ābim; ābīm         | [unknown]
woman; women       | lumbo; lumubwən | lumbum; lumbūm     | lumbu; lumbū
man; men           | rəḥbe; rəḥibyən | rēbim; rēbīm       | rēbi; rēbī
country; countries | yato; yatwən    | ēsum; ēsūm         | ēsu; ēsū/yātu; yātū

Also, the -n seen at the end of the nominative plurals of this language is not related to the nominative -m endings of Written Vrkhazhian, it is the plural -n seen in pronouns and verb agreement markers.

Posted: **Mon Oct 04, 2021 1:05 am**

I take it there are rules for the vowel epenthesis (which word I keep wanting to misspell)?

Posted: **Mon Oct 04, 2021 1:18 am**

They're mostly echo vowels, but some are remnants that didn't get elided to begin with.

EDIT: I think I will call it Šadə Ḥətšano / Śād Essānum "Essanite"

Posted: **Mon Oct 04, 2021 1:37 am**

I think it's a cool idea and you should keep on with it as long as it pleases you.

Posted: **Tue Oct 05, 2021 6:51 am**

I've composed some fiction (which I suppose must count as worldbuilding), and also worked out some sound changes, and prepared a bit of text in Ineshîmé, though it's incomplete.

Posted: **Wed Oct 06, 2021 4:54 pm**

Fleshed out case system more, now there is a large distinction between Vrkhazhian and the new language now known as Shannaric (Šadə Šənnarole). Although I can't think of anything for the locative cases

Posted: **Thu Oct 07, 2021 6:27 am**

Ahzoh wrote: ↑Sat Oct 02, 2021 9:51 pm I reduced the number of cases in Vrkhazhian from four to three, thought I don't know what to call the third case, because it functions as a postpositional case, genitive case and secondary object marking case of a ditransitive verb

Vrkhazian has six cases here though?

Not sure what the relationship is exactly between Shannaric and Vrkhazian but there's an e...i and o...u thing going on here with the suffixes. Maybe rahben...rebin and surgon...surgun? I'll leave you to work out the locative plurals if you like my suggestion.

Posted: **Thu Oct 07, 2021 7:02 am**

evmdbm wrote: ↑Thu Oct 07, 2021 6:27 amVrkhazian has six cases here though?

Evidently I must have decided I will have more cases after all.

Not sure what the relationship is exactly between Shannaric and Vrkhazian but there's an e...i and o...u thing going on here with the suffixes. Maybe rahben...rebin and surgon...surgun? I'll leave you to work out the locative plurals if you like my suggestion.

They share an ancestor. Shannaric went the route of laxing unstressed vowels and eliminating length. Vrkhazhian chose to elide and fuse weak consonants like /j w h/ etc.

I don't want to reuse an n-suffix as it already indicates the plural, at least as part of the nominative plural and in pronouns and verbal agreement suffixes.

Posted: **Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:05 am**

Just finished the overdue update of my conlang pages. Nothing new about my current conlangs, though - they are currently not in a presentable shape - but at least a page about some very old projects of mine, and more links to useful resources.

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2021 8:55 am**

masako wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 6:12 pm
masako wrote: ↑Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:07 pm
masako wrote: ↑Sun Aug 22, 2021 9:23 am as of today, I am at 333 glyphs for omyatloko, a third of my goal
360!
405!

528!!

Posted: **Sun Oct 17, 2021 11:05 am**

masako wrote: ↑Sun Oct 17, 2021 8:55 am
masako wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 6:12 pm
masako wrote: ↑Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:07 pm 360!
405!
528!!

Posted: **Mon Oct 18, 2021 5:12 pm**

I have realized that the reason (or the main reason) I'm having trouble with my cat conlang based on Japanese, is that I'm not sure if I want a full on separate language or if I want it to be more of a code the cats use to talk about things without humans catching on. Or somewhere between? A separate language that superficially sounds like Japanese but if you listened it wouldn't make sense. But that doesn't seem as useful, and would probably be very suspect during the Edo Period.

So at least I've decided for sure not to take the middle ground.

Posted: **Mon Oct 18, 2021 7:40 pm**

You could always do what I did and make a language that, if it existed, would be related to Japanese, and sounds a lot like it, but isn't mutually-intelligible with it.

Posted: **Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:42 pm**

stayed up way too late doing it but i finally got adjective declension where i want it for the first stage in an eventual modern-day daughter of gothic

More: show

btw does anyone know how to do rowspan/colspan in phpbb??

Posted: **Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:42 pm**

Emily wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:42 pm btw does anyone know how to do rowspan/colspan in phpbb??

I’m pretty sure it’s impossible. (Unless zompist adds new tags, of course.)

Posted: **Sat Oct 23, 2021 7:30 pm**

WeepingElf wrote: ↑Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:05 am Just finished the overdue update of my conlang pages. Nothing new about my current conlangs, though - they are currently not in a presentable shape - but at least a page about some very old projects of mine, and more links to useful resources.

I enjoyed this.

Posted: **Sat Oct 23, 2021 7:47 pm**

bradrn wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 6:42 pm
Emily wrote: ↑Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:42 pm btw does anyone know how to do rowspan/colspan in phpbb??
I’m pretty sure it’s impossible. (Unless zompist adds new tags, of course.)

If this is like having merged cells in a table in Word or similar, I would love to have this.

Posted: **Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:55 pm**

Given the new case overhaul for Vrkhazhian, it has raised questions about how to approach case when nouns use the possessive suffixes, and then I decided to go the Turkic way of putting the case morphemes after the possessive suffixes.

surğum "chicken"

More: show

Kūwas surğātik palta.
we gave her our chickens.

Mannāḫākunas ku kīnas ṣabâmmin le mannāḫākunas ku kīnas ṣābammin. Satâ Aḳālum nabliltin nuñṣ́urākinas niñ.
In their temples seek them and in their temples slay them. The enemies of Akal will pay for their insolence.

	Masc Sg	Neut Sg	Fem Sg	Masc Pl	Neut Pl	Fem Pl
Nom	ʒjaks	ʒjak, ʒjakat	ʒjaka	ʒjakɛ	ʒjaka	ʒjakos
Acc	ʒjakan	ʒjak, ʒjakat	ʒjaka	ʒjakanz	ʒjaka	ʒjakos
Gen	ʒjatsɛs	ʒjatsɛs	ʒjatsɛz	ʒjakɛʒ	ʒjakɛʒ	ʒjakɛz
Dat	ʒjakam	ʒjakam	ʒjakɛ	ʒjakɛm	ʒjakɛm	ʒjakɛm

	Masc Sg	Neut Sg	Fem Sg	Masc Pl	Neut Pl	Fem Pl
Nom	ʒjaka	ʒjako	ʒjako	ʒjakanz	ʒjakon	ʒjakonz
Acc	ʒjakan	ʒjako	ʒjakon	ʒjakanz	ʒjakon	ʒjakonz
Gen	ʒjatsɛnz	ʒjatsɛnz	ʒjatsonz	ʒjakaɲ	ʒjakaɲ	ʒjakon
Dat	ʒjakɛn	ʒjakɛn	ʒjakon	ʒjakam	ʒjakam	ʒjakom

	Masc Sg	Neut Sg	Fem Sg	Masc Pl	Neut Pl	Fem Pl
Nom	kɔʊrɔs	kɔʊrɔ, kɔʊrat	kɔʊrɔs	kɔʊrɛ	kɔʊra	kɔʊros
Acc	kɔʊran	kɔʊrɔ, kɔʊrat	kɔʊrɔ	kɔʊranz	kɔʊra	kɔʊros
Gen	kɔʊʝɔs	kɔʊʝɔs	kɔʊʝɔz	kɔʊrɛʒ	kɔʊrɛʒ	kɔʊrɛz
Dat	kɔʊram	kɔʊram	kɔʊrɛ	kɔʊrɛm	kɔʊrɛm	kɔʊrɛm

	Masc Sg	Neut Sg	Fem Sg	Masc Pl	Neut Pl	Fem Pl
Nom	kɔʊrɔ	kɔʊro	kɔʊro	kɔʊrɔnz	kɔʊron	kɔʊronz
Acc	kɔʊrɔn	kɔʊro	kɔʊron	kɔʊrɔnz	kɔʊron	kɔʊronz
Gen	kɔʊʝɔnz	kɔʊʝɔnz	kɔʊʝonz	kɔʊrɔɲ	kɔʊrɔɲ	kɔʊron
Dat	kɔʊrɔn	kɔʊrɔn	kɔʊron	kɔʊrɔm	kɔʊrɔm	kɔʊrom

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