Zompist Bboard Again

If you have a text with a specific number of words or a specific number of characters in it, is there some easy way to determine how many pages that text would take up in a book in a given format with a specific font size?

There is: https://wordcounter.net/words-per-page

Well, you may have a prayer with https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/typog ... gcharwidth and the vertical metrics in that table, though the vertical spacing could be defined in terms of the hhea table. However, you question is very open. For starters, the answer could depend on which script you're using, and e.g. for Vietnamese, on what you mean by a character.

Thank you! Latin script. English language.

Ares Land wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:54 pm There is: https://wordcounter.net/words-per-page

Now I wonder: is there a simple way to tell the font size and page format of a paper book I own, if I've never seen any of the files that were used during the writing and production of that book? Just so that I can then calculate how many pages a new book would have if it would use the same font, font size, and page format?

Raphael wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 2:23 pm

Ares Land wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:54 pm There is: https://wordcounter.net/words-per-page

Now I wonder: is there a simple way to tell the font size and page format of a paper book I own, if I've never seen any of the files that were used during the writing and production of that book? Just so that I can then calculate how many pages a new book would have if it would use the same font, font size, and page format?

For page format, you can simply measure it with a ruler. For font identification I like http://www.identifont.com/; once you know the font, you can download or buy it and figure out the font size.

Thank you!

bradrn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 4:51 pm For page format, you can simply measure it with a ruler. For font identification I like http://www.identifont.com/; once you know the font, you can download or buy it and figure out the font size.

For font size, you must also consider the leading (which rimes with 'Reading'). That's why the site Ares Land recommended asks about line spacing, as in single/double.

Richard W wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 5:07 am

bradrn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 4:51 pm For page format, you can simply measure it with a ruler. For font identification I like http://www.identifont.com/; once you know the font, you can download or buy it and figure out the font size.

For font size, you must also consider the leading (which rimes with 'Reading'). That's why the site Ares Land recommended asks about line spacing, as in single/double.

I don’t see why leading matters. I’d figure out font size by looking at the letters, not the space between them — the latter varies in any case.

bradrn wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 5:24 am

Richard W wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 5:07 am

bradrn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 27, 2023 4:51 pm For page format, you can simply measure it with a ruler. For font identification I like http://www.identifont.com/; once you know the font, you can download or buy it and figure out the font size.

For font size, you must also consider the leading (which rimes with 'Reading'). That's why the site Ares Land recommended asks about line spacing, as in single/double.

I don’t see why leading matters. I’d figure out font size by looking at the letters, not the space between them — the latter varies in any case.

Double spaced text gets half as many lines per page as single spaced text, if the letters are the same size. (And we still haven't considered features like condensation.) One can measure spacing between lines by measuring say 10 lines with an ordinary ruler, but measuring the size of letters is far fiddlier.

Question to people who know more about programming than I do: What would you say, to which extent does the ability to understand programming basically come down to the ability to understand the three concepts of a function, a conditional, and a variable?

Raphael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 8:30 am Question to people who know more about programming than I do: What would you say, to which extent does the ability to understand programming basically come down to the ability to understand the three concepts of a function, a conditional, and a variable?

They are three very, very basic concepts. You couldn't go anywhere at all without understanding these.

Ares Land wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 9:18 am
They are three very, very basic concepts. You couldn't go anywhere at all without understanding these.

Yes, but how far can you go with knowing them? They are basically the three main points I remember from my school programming classes, and I've wondered for a while how close this brings me to a general understanding of programming.

Raphael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 9:34 am

Ares Land wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 9:18 am
They are three very, very basic concepts. You couldn't go anywhere at all without understanding these.

Yes, but how far can you go with knowing them? They are basically the three main points I remember from my school programming classes, and I've wondered for a while how close this brings me to a general understanding of programming.

Not very far. I have a couple of traumatic memories involving managers and that dreaded sentence "what's so complicated about it? just add an 'if...'"

For object-oriented programming this is wrapped in different metaphors you have to figure out; if you write C or C++ (for instance) you need to have some understanding of how memory is allocated.

You need at least some basic notions of algorithmics and complexity.

Just to give a sample; the particular concepts may vary depending on language and/or field.

The good thing though is that with the basics and common sense, learning the rest isn't really that difficult.

At the extreme reductionist level, it basically boils down to 1 = "do it", 0 = "don't it".

Ares Land wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 10:03 am

Raphael wrote: ↑Wed Mar 15, 2023 9:34 am Yes, but how far can you go with knowing them? They are basically the three main points I remember from my school programming classes, and I've wondered for a while how close this brings me to a general understanding of programming.

Not very far.

Correct, I'm afraid. If you do understand them, I'd say the next step is to understand the algorithm. You learn what one is, you learn how some of them work, and you learn how to write them.

The basic difference between programmers and normal humans is that programming involves figuring out how a process works at a level of detail that most people would find excessive or boring, and thinking of weird cases that most people only think about when they occur.

zompist wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:45 amThe basic difference between programmers and normal humans is that programming involves figuring out how a process works at a level of detail that most people would find excessive or boring, and thinking of weird cases that most people only think about when they occur.

Programming has indeed been described as "the boring art of dealing with a large number of trivialities", as well as "a discipline akin to mathematics and astrology, but lacking the precision of the former and the popularity of the latter". I like to think of it as akin to certain types of religious practice: you assemble a highly complex offering to an amorphous and very pernickety being who will only accept it and do what you want if you get every detail of the ritual exactly correct. Which, as zompist points out, is not something most people are mentally capable of doing.

alice wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:55 am I like to think of it as akin to certain types of religious practice: you assemble a highly complex offering to an amorphous and very pernickety being who will only accept it and do what you want if you get every detail of the ritual exactly correct. Which, as zompist points out, is not something most people are mentally capable of doing.

I've seen it being argued that this is one of the reasons why IT took off so strongly in India, as some forms of Hinduism demand exactly that kind of mindset.

hwhatting wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:52 am

alice wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:55 am I like to think of it as akin to certain types of religious practice: you assemble a highly complex offering to an amorphous and very pernickety being who will only accept it and do what you want if you get every detail of the ritual exactly correct. Which, as zompist points out, is not something most people are mentally capable of doing.

I've seen it being argued that this is one of the reasons why IT took off so strongly in India, as some forms of Hinduism demand exactly that kind of mindset.

Apparently this is common in rituals, at least Indo–European ones: I like https://acoup.blog/2019/11/01/collectio ... k-religion as an example of this.

bradrn wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 7:25 am Apparently this is common in rituals, at least Indo–European ones: I like https://acoup.blog/2019/11/01/collectio ... k-religion as an example of this.

Well, one can argue that Hinduism is the last surviving IE religion. But according to all I have read, the Brahmanic tradition is extreme in its stickkling for detail even compared to other IE religioons.