Zompist Bboard Again

(Just a note that the "correct" pronunciation of the grammatical term "ablative" is with stress on the initial syllable, whatever phonological alternations then apply to the word in your particular idiolect)

lineage = /'lɪnijɪdʒ/ [which is weird because I'm pretty sure my brain segments that as /'lɪ.ni.jɪdʒ/, with no coda consonant after /ɪ/....(??)]
temporal = /'tɛm.pɚ.rəl/

bbbosborne wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:46 am how do you pronounce:
lineage
temporal

/linɨjɨdʒ/ [ˈɫɪniɪ̈dʒ]
/tempərəl/ [tʰɛmpɚɫ̩]

lineage [ˈʟ̞ɘ̃ː(n)iːˌɘːtʃ]~[ˈɰɘ̃ː(n)iːˌɘːtʃ]
temporal [ˈtʰɜ̃ː(m)pʁ̩ːʁɯ(ː)]

Whimemsz wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:59 am lineage = /'lɪnijɪdʒ/ [which is weird because I'm pretty sure my brain segments that as /'lɪ.ni.jɪdʒ/, with no coda consonant after /ɪ/....(??)]

I have what I think is basically the same pronunciation, but I don't perceive a /j/ there: I would transcribe it, including syllabification, as /ˈlɪn.iː.ɪdʒ/. If I try to say /ˈlɪniːjɪdʒ/ it comes out differently.

lineage [ˈɫɪniəʤ] (my syllabification agrees with Anteallach's: [ˈɫɪn.i.əʤ])
temporal [ˈtʰɛmpʰɹ̠ˁɫ̩]

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:26 pm Saw some spelling homework for children, and realised I pronounced something "wrong".

How does everyone pronounce "version"?

I guess I need to be more specific. I have "version" with /S/, not /Z/. Does anybody else?

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:55 pm

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:26 pm Saw some spelling homework for children, and realised I pronounced something "wrong".

How does everyone pronounce "version"?

I guess I need to be more specific. I have "version" with /S/, not /Z/. Does anybody else?

It’s S for me too. If I try pronouncing it with a Z, I feel like I’m hypercorrecting.

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:55 pm

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:26 pm Saw some spelling homework for children, and realised I pronounced something "wrong".

How does everyone pronounce "version"?

I guess I need to be more specific. I have "version" with /S/, not /Z/. Does anybody else?

As far as I know, /ʃ/ is usual in British English. /ʒ/ in "-rsion" words is mostly an American English thing (at least, according to Teflpedia).

Actually, I used to have an extended use of /ʒ/ even in (some) -lsion words, like revulsion and propulsion, but I consciously switched to using /lʃ/ in these words after looking them up in dictionaries and finding that /lʒ/ pronunciations typically weren't listed. I asked about them on the past board, and got mixed replies: http://www.incatena.org/viewtopic.php?f ... 5#p1124395 Some replies also talked about -rsion words like version.

lineage, temporal

For me lineage sounds fairly natural with two syllables (/ˈlɪnjɪdʒ/~/ˈlɪnjədʒ/), although I think I'd be more likely to think of it as being pronounced with three. Temporal doesn't feel natural with two syllables, although syncope would be possible in some forced context like poetry. I don't think I aspirate the /p/ (or at least, not as much as the /t/), so I'd transcribe my pronunciation as something like [ˈtʰɛmpɹ̩əɫ]. The phonetic distinction between syllabic resonants and schwa + resonant sequences is not salient to my ears, so I can't say with confidence which I use in this word.

Estav wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:13 pm

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:55 pm

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:26 pm Saw some spelling homework for children, and realised I pronounced something "wrong".

How does everyone pronounce "version"?

I guess I need to be more specific. I have "version" with /S/, not /Z/. Does anybody else?

As far as I know, /ʃ/ is usual in British English. /ʒ/ in "-rsion" words is mostly an American English thing (at least, according to Teflpedia).

That's funny; I remember being struck once by Frankie Boyle's pronunciation of version with /ʃ/. I thought this was part of his Scottish accent.

cardinal [ˈkʰɑːʁnːɯ(ː)]
carnal [ˈkʰɑ̃ːʁ̃nɯ(ː)]
midnight [ˈmɘːnˌnəe̯ʔ]
good night [ˈkʊːnˌnəe̯ʔ]
couldn't [ˈkʰʊːnː(ʔ)]~[ˈkʰʊː(ɾ)ɘ̃ʔ]
starting to [ˈsʲtʲʌʁnːəː]

Estav wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:13 pm

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:55 pm

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:26 pm Saw some spelling homework for children, and realised I pronounced something "wrong".

How does everyone pronounce "version"?

I guess I need to be more specific. I have "version" with /S/, not /Z/. Does anybody else?

As far as I know, /ʃ/ is usual in British English. /ʒ/ in "-rsion" words is mostly an American English thing (at least, according to Teflpedia).

Actually, I used to have an extended use of /ʒ/ even in (some) -lsion words, like revulsion and propulsion, but I consciously switched to using /lʃ/ in these words after looking them up in dictionaries and finding that /lʒ/ pronunciations typically weren't listed. I asked about them on the past board, and got mixed replies: http://www.incatena.org/viewtopic.php?f ... 5#p1124395 Some replies also talked about -rsion words like version.

I'm familiar with both /ʃ/ and /ʒ/ in version in BrE. I tend to use /ʒ/ myself, but I'm not sure I'm consistent.

The verb "process", and the noun "process" and its plural "processes". Asking because I've always assumed it's something like [ˈpɹo.sɛs] (both verb and noun) and /ˈpɹo.sɛs.ɪs/ for the plural (at least in RP), but I just heard an American pronouncing the plural something like [ˈpɹɑ.sə.siːz] (multiple times).


JAL

The stressed vowel sounds right, and I think all Americans will have that too. (Whether it's CAUGHT or COT will vary.) The final vowel is wrong, perhaps a hypercorrection to do with scientific plurals like theses

In the UK, jal's assumption is correct.

From Americans, I've heard the version jal's just heard, but I've also heard it with pro-, I think - although that might be a hearing error triggered by monophthongisation of the GOAT vowel in some speakers? Don't know.


EDIT: also, worth pointing out there's two different verbs - the normal verb, to apply a process to, is pronounced as the noun, but the verb meaning 'to move forward' is stressed on the second syllable. However, it's rarely encountered outside of astronomy and (semi-)religious rituals, elsewhere having been replaced by 'procede'.

jal wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:04 am The verb "process", and the noun "process" and its plural "processes". Asking because I've always assumed it's something like [ˈpɹo.sɛs] (both verb and noun) and /ˈpɹo.sɛs.ɪs/ for the plural (at least in RP), but I just heard an American pronouncing the plural something like [ˈpɹɑ.sə.siːz] (multiple times).


JAL

I've heard processes pronounced with /-siz/ as if it were a Greek ending quite regularly in the financial sector, but never or rarely elsewhere. Most Americans do indeed have COT vowel for process in both verb and noun, though I have occasionally heard /ou/--perhaps as a hypercorrection or an affectation imitating British pronunciation.

how do you pronounce
error
air

I pronounce it "please remove your signature, it's ugly and its size is borderline sociopathic, why must you ruin things for everybody else?"


Also, I pronounce them
/E\r@/
and
/E:/

Not actually a trill, obviously. And /E:/ may be /E:@/ or /E@/, depending.

error [ˈɛːʁʁ̩(ː)]
air [ɛ(ː)ʁ]

but:

mirror, mere [mɪ(ː)ʁ]

Salmoneus wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:09 am I pronounce it "please remove your signature, it's ugly and its size is borderline sociopathic, why must you ruin things for everybody else?"

Way to be subtle.

I have
error/era [e̞˞ə̯]
air [e̞ː]
mirror [mɪ˞ə̯]
mere [mɪə̯]
tomorrow [tʰəˈmɔ˞ə̯]

tomorrow [tʰə̃ːˈmɑːʁɵ(ː)]~[ɾə̃ːˈmɑːʁɵ(ː)]