Zompist Bboard Again

Man in Space wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:02 pm I am pleased to finally be able to announce that I’m scheduled to give a presentation at LCC 11 about the Caber logograms.

Wonderful!

bradrn wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2025 7:46 pm

Man in Space wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:02 pm I am pleased to finally be able to announce that I’m scheduled to give a presentation at LCC 11 about the Caber logograms.

Wonderful!

Thank you!

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The 1500º Caber logogram: ŭnec 'there was/were no(t)'.

Man in Space wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:02 pm I am pleased to finally be able to announce that I’m scheduled to give a presentation at LCC 11 about the Caber logograms.

thats excellent news; kudos

keenir wrote: ↑Sun Mar 02, 2025 4:22 pm

Man in Space wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2025 6:02 pm I am pleased to finally be able to announce that I’m scheduled to give a presentation at LCC 11 about the Caber logograms.

thats excellent news; kudos

Thank you!

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One glyph, 3 readings.

1. mvŭnj 'formal reception, audience, levee, tour'
2. mvŭnc 'pathogenic fungus, yeast (infection), fungal infection'
3. mvŭrgdi 'to live long, to prosper'

The original reading was mvŭnj. The readings mvŭnc and mvŭrgdi were acquired by phonetic punning.

Man in Space wrote: ↑Mon Mar 03, 2025 7:42 pm
One glyph, 3 readings.

1. mvŭnj 'formal reception, audience, levee, tour'
2. mvŭnc 'pathogenic fungus, yeast (infection), fungal infection'
3. mvŭrgdi 'to live long, to prosper'

The original reading was mvŭnj. The readings mvŭnc and mvŭrgdi were acquired by phonetic punning.

Its physical design seems to be based on the first reading.

Man in Space wrote: ↑Mon Mar 03, 2025 7:42 pm

1. mvŭnj 'formal reception, audience, levee, tour'
2. mvŭnc 'pathogenic fungus, yeast (infection), fungal infection'
3. mvŭrgdi 'to live long, to prosper'

The original reading was mvŭnj. The readings mvŭnc and mvŭrgdi were acquired by phonetic punning.

Is there no semantic determinative to disambiguate? Meaning #3, for instance, could be disambiguated with a Vulcan salute.

bradrn wrote: ↑Mon Mar 03, 2025 8:00 pm

Man in Space wrote: ↑Mon Mar 03, 2025 7:42 pm

1. mvŭnj 'formal reception, audience, levee, tour'
2. mvŭnc 'pathogenic fungus, yeast (infection), fungal infection'
3. mvŭrgdi 'to live long, to prosper'

The original reading was mvŭnj. The readings mvŭnc and mvŭrgdi were acquired by phonetic punning.

Is there no semantic determinative to disambiguate? Meaning #3, for instance, could be disambiguated with a Vulcan salute.

Full semantic determinatives in CC are rare. The common use case is for the 3SG.F which uses the sign for SOQUR 'woman' to disambiguate.

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This—with a background to make it easier on the eyes—is the reçuqu (lit. 'the way to weave [things]'), the grid against which the qanvanc ('glyphs, characters') are described. As to how to classify and describe strokes, let's add some flavor:



So what does this all mean?

• At first blush, the grid is divided into four quadrants called magovedoc (ma- INTENSIFIER + ogoved 'season' + -oc PLURAL):
  • At lower left is vih 'spring' (as in the season).
  • Above it, at upper left, is pŏrov 'summer'.
  • At lower right, qom 'autumn, fall'.
  • At upper right, we have jasin 'winter'.
• The big red dots are the oestoc ('big, large, greater, major') cŭjroc (sg. cŭjre), from cŭj 'to face, to orient towards' + -re). These have individual names:
  1. At bottom-left is the gidemre (< gidem 'to found, to establish, to start s.t. + -re).
  2. Middle-left is the rgax 'groundhog'.
  3. The top-left dot is called the bagamegi 'kite, pennant, standard, flag, wind sock'.
  4. At bottom-center we have the fŏas 'pebble'.
  5. The central dot is the rdŭn 'eye, hook, catch'.
  6. At top of center we have the qvup 'bird sp.'.
  7. The bottom-right is the ŏp 'foot'.
  8. At mid-right, you've got the acoŏ 'monkey'.
  9. The top-right dot is called the giar 'cliff, edge'.
• The mauve dots that look the color of my Aunt Jeannie's old luggage set are the tinc ('small, lesser, minor') cŭjroc. These too have names:
  1. At lower left is the fevih 'spring' (as in the season).
  2. Above it, at upper left, is the fepŏrov 'summer'.
  3. At lower right, the feqom 'autumn, fall'.
  4. At upper right, we have the fejasin 'winter'.
• The thick black lines are the niqi 'spine' (vertical) and qen 'tongue' (horizontal). The lower spine and the left tongue are considered baçax (baç 'near, proximally' + -ax ADJECTIVIZER) 'near(by)', with the upper spine and right tongue being considered hos 'far(away)'.
• The thick white lines are the ŭsbveqa (sg. ŭsbvec) 'jaws' and the ŏcŭaqa (sg. ŏcŭac) 'palms of the hands'. These get associated to their grid quadrant—e.g. qomax ŭsbvec for the right side of the lower edge, jasinax ŏcŭac for the upper portion of the right edge.
• Points not covered by the above are given with relation to the named component to which they are associated, using the following qualifiers:
  • cŭp '(to the) left'
  • ucçŏ 'above, on'
  • aqir '(to the) right'
  • ŭqan 'under, below'
  When you compound these, the vertical component comes first: ŭqancŭp 'below and to the left'.
• The ranks are divided into the horizontal oesnotoc (sg. oesnots) 'logs' and vertical rŏoc (sg. rŏa) 'tree-trunks'. These words came to mean 'row' and 'column', respectively, in many of the daughter languages.

When dealing with stroke order, standard practice is to start with the gidemre (i.e., at lower left), then go up vertically along the rŏa, then move to the next column on the oesnots, repeat, repeat. CC stroke directions are simple: There are no curves, and wth only a few exceptions (which I will get to later), they refuse to ascend vertically and refuse go left. You start with the first stroke you encounter on a given rŏa; in case you have multiple strokes starting at the same point, the one with the lowest terminus takes priority.

Take, for instance, the glyph gvaç:



With the reçuqu, stroke directions, and stroke order indicated:



The strokes would be described thus:

1. Ucço rgax, ŭqan rgax
2. Rgax, cŭp rdun
3. Ucçoqir rgax, ŭqanqir rgax
4. Ucço baçax qen, ŭqan baçax qen
5. Ucço qup rdun, ŭqancŭp rdun
6. Fŏas, ucço qomax ŭsbveqa, ŏp
7. Rdun, hos qen
8. Ŭqan qvup, fejasin, ucço qomax ŭsbveqa
9. Ŭqan qvup, jasinax ŭsbveqa

Man in Space wrote: ↑Sat Mar 08, 2025 2:48 pm

Something that’s been bothering me a bit throughout this: without actually having the template there, is it humanly possible to follow such a strict and dense arrangement of points? If it was a simple grid I would be less sceptical, but it’s not — it’s several slightly different grids together, sometimes with distinct points very close to each other indeed.