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Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 5:08 pm
by Rounin Ryuuji
I can just apply my changes to this (and add in some others)
  • As before [ɣ χ r] > [g ʁ̞ ʁ̞]; consonant + w > labialised consonant
  • Coda nasals disappear, lowering, lengthening, and nasalising preceding vowels;
  • Coda [h] disappears, lengthening and pharyngealising the preceding vowel; vowels after [h] also pharyngealise;
  • Glottalisation becomes devoicing and gemination medially, devoicing initially and terminally; glottal stop fortifies to [t];
  • Schwa is coloured to [o] by lablialisation; [a] by pharyngealisation, and shifts elsewhere to [e]
  • [w] and non-syllabic [u] > [v], or [f] before voiceless stops
gʷɔvis kʷoi ʁ̞ʷɔlhãˤː na haˤst
haˤkõːs gʷɔkʷɔt;
to tãːso vogõː ugãːtãː,
to mogaʁ̞ borõː,
to viˤːʁ̞õː hoˤːku brãːtõː.
vefkʷot gʷɔvis haˤkʷos:
“ʁ̞adgor haˤme keʁ̞t,
ʁ̞enarãː vit.tãːti haˤkumes ʁ̞ek.kãːtõː.”
vafkʷnet haˤkʷas: “kelu gʷova!
ʁ̞adgor nesma keʁ̞t vit.tanti,
ʁ̞ener, tasos, gʷujõː ʁ̞ulhaˤnõː
sʷa gʷɔʁ̞mõː vasti kʷoʁ̞ˈnauti,
gʷujõː-kʷɔ ʁ̞ʷɔlhãˤː na haˤsti.”
to kaklevus gʷɔvis plaʁ̞nõː befk.ket.

I have a feeling this might sound kind-of evil.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 5:29 pm
by Karch
1. ʁ̞ʷ > w
2. nasal vowels front: ã: õ: > ɛ̃: ã:
3. a > æ, unless pharyngealized or in the environment of uvular consonants
4. ʁ̞ (r) > ɣ, d > r intervocalically or before another voiced consonant
5. oi > e:
6. V1CC$ > V1CV1C$
7. f > h before a consonant or word-finally, otherwise > hʷ
8. Vh > Vˤ, h(ʷ)V > h(ʷ)Vˤ, h disappears after a consonant

gʷɔvis kʷeː wɔlɛ̃ˤː næ haˤsaˤt
haˤkãːs gʷɔkʷɔt;
to tɛ̃ːso vogãː ugɛ̃ːtɛ̃ː,
to mogaɣ boɣãː,
to viˤːɣãː hoˤːku bɣɛ̃ːtãː.
veˤkʷot gʷɔvis haˤkʷos:
“ɣargoɣ haˤme keɣet,
ɣenæɣãː vittɛ̃ːti haˤkumes ɣekkɛ̃ːtãː.”
væhʷæˤkʷnet haˤkʷæs: “kelu gʷovæ!
ɣargoɣ nesmæ keɣet vittɛ̃ːti,
ɣeneɣ, tæsos, gʷujãː ɣulaˤnãː
sʷæ gʷɔɣmãː vasti kʷoɣˈnæˤti,
gʷujɛ̃ː-kʷɔ wɔlɛ̃ˤː næ haˤsti.”
to kæklevus gʷɔvis plaɣnãː behʷeˤkket.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 5:55 pm
by Otto Kretschmer
have a feeling this might sound kind-of evil.
Devil's Indo European?

On a more serious not...e, it reminds me of Tocharian... no idea why.

I suggest adding the verb "to be" as a marker of perfective aspect. Would add something interesting

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 7:35 pm
by Neonnaut
  • ɣ > C /{#,V}_C
  • ɣ > w / C_V
  • ɔ o u > o u ɨ
  • ã(ː) > ɔ̃(ː)
  • b d g gʷ > p t k kʷ
  • v ɣ > b g
  • Stress disappears.
kʷobis kʷeː wolɛ̃ˤː næ haˤsaˤt
haˤkɔ̃ːs kʷokʷot;
tu tɛ̃ːsu bukɔ̃ː ɨkɛ̃ːtɛ̃ː,
tu mukag pugɔ̃ː,
tu biˤːgɔ̃ː hoˤːkɨ pwɛ̃ːtɔ̃ː.
beˤkʷut kʷobis haˤkʷus:
“garkug haˤme keget,
genægɔ̃ː bittɛ̃ːti haˤkɨmes gekkɛ̃ːtɔ̃ː.”
bæhʷæˤkʷnet haˤkʷæs: “kelɨ kʷubæ!
garkug nesmæ keget bittɛ̃ːti,
geneg, tæsus, kʷɨjɔ̃ː gɨlaˤnɔ̃ː
sʷæ kʷommɔ̃ː basti kʷunnæˤti,
kʷɨjɛ̃ː-kʷo wolɛ̃ˤː næ haˤsti.”
tu kæklebɨs kʷobis plannɔ̃ː pehʷeˤkket.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 8:50 pm
by Rounin Ryuuji
  • Vowel chain shift [ɨ e æ o u a] > [i i ɛ u y ɔ], but the shift is blocked by pharyngealisation; [æˤ oˤ eˤ] > [aˤ ɛˤ ɔˤ]; pharyngealisation is subsequently lost;
  • Nasalisation of vowels is lost;
  • Long vowels break [iː ɔː ɛː] > [ɛi uɛ ia], but [ɛː] > [ɛi] after [w j];
  • [k g] > [c j] before [i y]; [t d s] > [tʃ dʒ ʃ] before [y]; [sʷ] > [ʃʷ]
kʷubis kʷɛi wulia nɛ hasat
hɔkuɛs kʷukʷut;
tʃy tiaʃy bykuɛ i.cia.tia
tʃy mykɔg pyguɛ,
tʃy bɛiguɛ huɛci pwɛituɛ
bekʷyt kʷubis hakʷys:
“gɔrcyg hɔmi cijit,
jinɛguɛ bittiati hacimis jikkiatuɛ."
bɛhʷakʷnit hakʷɛs: “kili kʷybɛ!
gɔrcyg nismɛ cijit bittiati,
jinig, tɛʃys, kʷijuɛ jilanuɛ
ʃʷɛ kʷummuɛ bɔsti kʷynnaˤti,
kʷijɛi-kʷu wulia nɛ hasti.”
tʃy kɛklibis kʷubis plɔnnuɛ pihʷɛccit.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 9:45 pm
by bradrn
  1. uɛ ia → œy iə
  2. a e ɛi i → ɔ ø œy y / after a labialised consonant
  3. kʷ ʃʷ hʷ → k ʃ w
  4. h → ∅ / #_
  5. c → tʃ
  6. Unconditional consonant degemination
  7. s → i / in coda; simplification of resulting hiatus: ii œyi yi → i œji œi
  8. ɔr → ɔu
  9. Cl → l
  10. Stops nasalise in coda: t k ɡ → n ŋ ŋ
  11. Front vowels back, rounded vowels deround
  12. b → β / V_V
kuβɯ kɛi wuliə nʌ asan
ɔkɛjɯ kukun;
tʃi tiəʃi bikɛi ɯ.tʃiə.tiə
tʃi mikɔŋ piɡɛi,
tʃi bɛiɡɛi ɛitʃɯ pwɛitɛi
bɤkin kuβɯ akɛi:
“ɡɔutʃiŋ ɔmɯ tʃɯjɯn,
jɯnʌɡɛi bɯtiətɯ atʃɯmɯ jɯkiətɛi."
bʌwɔŋnɯn akʌs: “kɯlɯ kiβʌ!
ɡɔutʃiŋ nɯmʌ tʃɯjɯn bɯtiətɯ,
jɯnɯŋ, tʌʃɛi, kijɛi jɯlanɛi
ʃʌ kumɛi bɔitɯ kinatɯ,
kijɛi-ku wuliə nʌ aitɯ.”
tʃi kʌlɯβɯ kuβɯ lɔnɛi pɯwʌtʃɯn.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Tue Aug 17, 2021 10:59 pm
by Rounin Ryuuji
  • Short vowel mergers [u ɯ] > [ʉ], [a ʌ] > [ɐ̞]; [ɤ ɔ] > [o̞]; [ɛ ə] > [e̞], but the second of two successive schwas is instead lost;
  • Voiced stops and fricatives elide between vowels, the coalescence of vowels produces some new long vowels;
  • Diphthongs smooth, [ɛi ɔu ɔi ai] > [e̞ː o̞ː iː aː];
  • [tʃ] > [ʃ], or [ɕ] before [i]; [ʃeː] > [ɕiː]; [j] > [ʒ~ʑ] except after [i];
  • [t k] palatalise to [s cɕ] before [i[/i], followed by loss of terminal -i and lengthening of the preceding vowel; loss of terminal [i] after [ɕ] with same compensatory lengthening;
    [*]Loss of [ʉ] from the end of words of more than three syllables, with compensatory lengthening; blocked by a preceding long vowel
    [*]Loss of [w] except after stops; loss of stops before [w]
    [*]Invention of a fancy new thing called writing!]
kʉː ke̞ː ʉlio̞ nɐ̞ ɐ̞sɐ̞n
o̞ge̞ʒʉ kʉ̞kʉ̞n;
ɕi sio̞ːɕ bike̞ː ʉ.ɕio̞ːs
ɕi miko͉ŋ piɡe̞ː,
ɕi be̞ːʒe̞ː e̞ʃʉ we̞ːte̞ː
bo̞ːc͡ɕin kʉː ake̞ː:
“ɡo̞ːɕiŋ o̞mʉ ʃʉʒʉn,
ʒʉnɐ̞ke̞ː bʉsio̞ːt ɐ̞ʃʉːm ʒʉcɕio̞te̞."
bɐ̞wo̞ŋnʉn ɐ̞kɐ̞s: “kʉlʉ cɕijɐ̞!
ɡo̞ːɕiŋ nʉmɐ̞ ʃʉʒʉn bʉsio̞ːt,
ʒʉnʉŋ, tɐ̞ɕiː, cɕije̞ː ʒʉlɐ̞ne̞ː
ʃɐ̞ kʉme̞ biːtʉ cɕinɐ̞ːt,
cɕije̞ː-kʉ ʉliɐ̞ nɐ̞ aːtʉ.”
ɕi kɐ̞lʉː kʉː lo̞neː pʉwɐ̞ʃʉn.

Cû chê ulio na asan,
Ogheju cucun;
Sci siôsc' bichê usciôs
Sci micong pighê
Sci bêjê escju vêtê:
Bôcin cû achê:
"Gôscing, omu scjujun,
Junachê busiôt ascjûm juciôte."
Bavongnun acas: "Culu cia!
Gôscing numa scjujun busiôt,
Junung, tascî, cijê julanê
Scja cume bîtu cinât,
Ciê-cu ulia na âtu."
Sci calû cû lonê puvascjun.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Wed Aug 18, 2021 12:18 am
by Neonnaut
  • {c͡ɕ cɕ} ? {ɕ ʃ} ʒ > ʈʂ ɖʐ ʂ ʐ
  • ʉː > æ̆ʉ
  • j > h
  • eː → æj
  • ʉ̞ > ʉ
  • ŋ > n / {i, e̞, ʉ̞}(ː)_#
  • n > ŋ / _ŋ
  • s ʂ t > h s ʔ / _#
  • io̞ iɐ̞> iwo ija / C_C
kæ̆ʉ kæj ʉliwo̞ nɐ̞ ɐ̞sɐ̞n
o̞ge̞ʐʉ kʉkʉn;
ʂi siwo̞ːs bikæj ʉʂiwo̞ːh
ʂi miko͉ŋ piɡæː,
ʂi bæjʐæj e̞ʂʉ wæjtæj
bo̞ːʈʂin kæ̆ʉ akæj:
“ɡo̞ːʂin o̞mʉ ʂʉʐʉn,
ʐʉnɐ̞kæj bʉsiwo̞ːʔ ɐ̞ʂæ̆ʉm ʐʉʈʂiwo̞te̞."
bɐ̞wo̞ŋŋʉn ɐ̞kɐ̞h: “kʉlʉ ʈʂihɐ̞!
ɡo̞ːʂin nʉmɐ̞ ʂʉʐʉn bʉsiwo̞ːʔ,
ʐʉnʉn, tɐ̞ʂiː, ʈʂihæj ʐʉlɐ̞næj
ʂɐ̞ kʉme̞ biːtʉ ʈʂinɐ̞ːʔ,
ʈʂihæj-kʉ ʉlijɐ̞ nɐ̞ aːtʉ.”
ʂi kɐ̞læ̆ʉ kæ̆ʉ lo̞næj pʉwɐ̞ʂʉn.

Cû cê uliwo na asan,
Ogeju cucun;
Sci siwôsc' bicê usciwôh
Sci micong pigê
Sci bêjê escu vêtê:
Bôcin cû acê:
"Gôscin, omu scujun,
Junachê busiôt ascûm juchiwôte."
Bavongngun acah: "Culu chiha!
Gôscin numa scsujun busiwôt,
Junun, tascî, chihê julanê
Sca cume bîtu chinât,
Chihê-cu uliya na âtu."
Sci calû cû lonê puvascun.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Thu Aug 19, 2021 7:12 pm
by Neonnaut
  • {c͡ɕ cɕ} ? {ɕ ʃ} ʒ > ʈʂ ɖʐ ʂ ʐ
  • æj > æ̆i
  • ʐ > z > r
  • o̞ː > uː
  • Vː > V / _{ʔ, h}#
  • æ̆ʉ æ̆i ʉ i > œ ɛː ʏ ɪ
  • ʂ → ʃ
  • ʈʂ > tt / V_V
  • ʈʂ > t
  • o̞ e̞ > ɛ ɔ
  • æː ɐ̞ a > ɑ(ː)
  • Progressive rounding harmony: (ɪ iː ɛ ɛː ɯ ɯː ɑ ɑː) vs (ʏ yː œ œː u uː ɔ ɔː)
kœ kɛː ʏlʏwɔ nɑ ɑsɑn
ɔgœrʏ kʏkʏn;
ʃɪ sɪwɯːs bɪkɛː ʏʃʏwuh
ʃɪ mɪkɑŋ pɪɡɑː,
ʃɪ bɛːrɛː ɛʃɪ wɛːtɛː
buːttʏn kœ ɑkɛː:
“ɡuːʃʏn ɔmʏ ʃʏrʏn,
rʏnɔkœː bʏsʏwuʔ ɑʃɛm rʏttʏwɔtœ."
bɑwɑŋŋɪn ɑkɑh: “kʏlʏ tɪhɑ!
ɡuːʃʏn nʏmɔ ʃʏrʏn bʏsʏwuʔ,
rʏnʏn, tɑʃiː, tɪhɛː rʏlɔnœː
ʃɑ kʏmœ byːtʏ tɪnɑʔ,
tɪhɛː-kɪ ʏlʏjɔ nɑ ɑːtɪ.”
ʃɪ kɑlɛ kœ lɔnœː pʏwɔʃʏn.

Cû cê uliwo na asan,
Ogeju cucun;
Sci siwôsc' bicê usciwôh
Sci micong pigê
Sci bêjê escu vêtê:
Bôcin cû acê:
"Gôscin, omu scujun,
Junachê busiôt ascûm juchiwôte."
Bavongngun acah: "Culu chiha!
Gôscin numa scsujun busiwôt,
Junun, tascî, chihê julanê
Sca cume bîtu chinât,
Chihê-cu uliya na âtu."
Sci calû cû lonê puvascun.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 3:34 am
by Darren
  • k ɡ → t͡ʃ d͡z /_V[+front]
  • y,ʏ œ → ʉ ɞ → ɯ ʌ
  • iː ɯː uː ɛː ʌː ɑː → ɵi̯ ɘu̯ æo̯ i̯ɒ iɐ̯ ɒe̯
  • wi̯ → uj → ud͡z
  • ti̯ t͡ʃi̯ si̯ hi̯ ʃi̯ di̯ → t͡ʃ t͡ʃ ʃ ʃ ʃ d͡z
  • ki̯ ɡi̯ → c ɟ
  • i̯V → ɟV
  • ɔ ɑ ʌ → o ɒ a
  • ɯ → v̩~f̩~v~f
[t͡ʃa t͡ʃɒ vlv̩wo nɒ ɒsɒn
od͡zarv t͡ʃf̩t͡ʃv̩n
ʃɪ sɪwɘu̯s bɪt͡ʃɒ fʃv̩wuh
ʃɪ mɪkɒŋ pɪɡɒe̯
ʃɪ bɟɒrɟɒ ɛʃɪ ud͡zɒt͡ʃɒ
bæo̯ttv̩n t͡ʃa ɒcɒ
ɡæo̯ʃv̩n omv ʃv̩rv̩n
rv̩not͡ʃiɐ̯ bv̩sv̩wuʔ ɒʃɛm rv̩ttv̩wota
bɒwɒŋŋɪn ɒkɒh t͡ʃv̩lv tɪhɒ
ɡæo̯ʃv̩n nv̩mo ʃv̩rv̩n bv̩sv̩wuʔ
rv̩nv̩n tɒʃɵi̯ tɪʃɒ rv̩loniɐ̯
ʃɒ t͡ʃv̩ma bɘu̯tf tɪnɒʔ
tɪʃɒ-t͡ʃɪ vlv̩ɟo nɒ ɒe̯tɪ
ʃɪ kɒlɛ ka loniɐ̯ pfwoʃv̩n]

Ça çq vlvwo nq qsqn,
Oʒarv çfçvn;
Şi siweus biçq fşvwuh
Şi mikqng pigqæ,
Şi bĝqrĝq æşi uʒqçq
Bæottvn ça qcq:
Gæoşvn, omv şvrvn,
Rvnoçia bvsvwủ qşæm rvttvwota."
Bqwqngngin qkqh: "Çvlv tihq!
Gæoşvn vnmo şvrvn bvsvwủ,
Rvnvn, tqşei, tişq rvlonia
Şq çvma beutf tinq̉,
Tişq-çi vlvĝo nq qæti."
Şi kqlæ ka lonia pfwoşvn.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 8:56 am
by Otto Kretschmer
Vântul de nord și soarele disputau care dintre ele era cel mai puternic, când un călător a venit înfășurat într-o mantie caldă

['Vɨntul de nord ʃi so'arele dispu'tau 'kare 'dintre ele era kel mai pute'rnik, kɨnd un kɘlɘ'tor a 'venit ɨnfɘʃu'rat 'ɨntro 'mantie 'kaldɘ]

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 12:34 pm
by Rounin Ryuuji
  • [ɨ] merges with [i], [ɘ a] merge to [ɐ], but [an ar] + consonant are unaffected;
  • [o.a au or in er ai an] > [waː oː oː iː eː eː aː]
  • [k] > [c] before [e i]; [ʃ t d] > [ɕ c͡ɕ ɟ͡ʑ] before [i]; [ʃ] > [ʂ] elsewhere; [s] > [ʂ] before [w]; [t] > [ts] before [r u i]
Vîtul de nord si suârele disputô care dître ele era cel mai putênic, chîd un calator a venit îfașurat îtro mâtie calda.
['viːt͡sul de noːd ɕi ʂwaːrele ɟʑispu'toː 'kɐre 'ɟʑiːtsre ele erɐ kel meː puteː'nik, ciːd un kɐlɐ'tor ɐ 'venit iːfɐʂu'rat 'iːt͡sro 'maːc͡ɕie 'kaldɐ]

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 12:53 pm
by Otto Kretschmer
Disappearance of articles

Vît de nord si suâre disputô care dître ele era cel mai putênic, chîd calator a venit îfașurat îtro mâtie calda.
['viːt͡s de noːd ɕi ʂwaːre ɟʑispu'toː 'kɐre 'ɟʑiːtsre ele erɐ kel meː puteː'nik, ciːd kɐlɐ'tor ɐ 'venit iːfɐʂu'rat 'iːt͡sro 'maːc͡ɕie 'kaldɐ]

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Fri Aug 20, 2021 1:09 pm
by Rounin Ryuuji
  • Palatalisation of other consonants before [i];
  • Laxing of short vowels; [e i o u] > [ɛ ɪ ɔ ʊ]; but short [i] is preserved after palatal stops, fricatives, and affricates, where it lengthens in non-function words;
  • Intertonic unstressed short vowels, and vowels in unstressed open syllables in function words other than [i] tend to become schwa;
  • Terminal stops link onto following initial vowels, or else are lost entirely; [t͡s], which reduces to [s]; some earlier surface filters apply across morpheme boundaries;
  • German influence becomes extremely pronounced in Eastern Europe, and its orthography influences an orthographic reform:
['vʲiːs də noː ɕi ʂwaːrɛ ɟʑiːs.pə'toː 'kɐrɛ 'ɟʑiːtsrɛ ɛlə ɛrɐ kɛl meː pəteː'ɲi, ciː kɐlɐ'tɔr͜ ə 'vɛɲɪc͡ɕ͜ iːfɐʂə'rɐc͡ɕ͜ 'iːt͡srɔ maː'c͡ɕiː.je 'kɐldɐ]
Wîs dĕ nord schi schwâre dîspĕtô kare dîzre elĕ era kel mer pĕterni, kîd kalator ĕ wenit îfaschĕrat izro mâtîje kalda.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Sat Aug 21, 2021 11:35 pm
by Neonnaut
  • ɲ > nʲ
  • Deletion of [ə] except in monosyllables.
  • ɔ oː o eː ɐ ɛ ɪ > o uː u iː ə a i
  • {r, l}V[-stress] > V[-stress]{r, l} / C_
['vʲiːs də nuː ɕi ʂwaːra ɟʑiːsp'tuː 'kəra 'ɟʑiːtsar al arə kal miː ptiː'nʲi, ciː kələ'tur͜ ə 'vanʲic͡ɕ͜ iːfəʂ'rəc͡ɕ͜ 'iːt͡sur maː'c͡ɕiː.je 'kəldə]
Wîs dĕ nord schi schwâre dîsptô kare dîzer el era kel mer pĕterni, kî kalator a wenit îfaschĕrat izor mâtîje kalda.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2021 12:21 am
by Rounin Ryuuji
  • Deletion of most schwa, either with (1) compensatory lengthening of a preceding vowel, or (2) the absorption of a function word into the one that precedes; stressed schwa becomes [eː], remaining unstressed schwa [e]
  • Long vowels break, [iː uː aː eː] > [ei ou ou ie]
  • [v] > [w]
  • A new popular orthography begins to appear, with silent "e" becoming normative through vowel loss and analogues in English and French.
['weist nou ɕi ʂwoura ɟʑeisp'tou 'kiera 'ɟʑeitsar al our kal mei pc͡ɕei'nʲi, cei kle'tour 'wanʲic͡ɕ͜ eifʂ'riec͡ɕ͜ 'eit͡sur maː'c͡ɕei.je 'kielde]
Wejste nourd schi schwoura dejsptou kjera djejzar al our kal mejre petejrni, kjej keletoure wanic' ejfescherec' ejzur mâtjejje kjelde.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2021 4:25 am
by Neonnaut
  • c͡ɕ ɟʑ > t͡ɕ d͡ʑ
  • r c > ɻ t
  • {kl,ɡl,lj} > ʎ
  • ou ei > oʊ eɪ
  • k → kʷ / _a
  • aː > ɒ
  • Epenthetic [ɪ] where S is a plosive or affricate: {#, C}S_S
['weɪst noʊ ɕi ʂwoʊɻa d͡ʑeɪspɪ'toʊ 'kieɻa 'd͡ʑeɪt͡saɻ al oʊɻ kʷal meɪ pɪt͡ɕeɪ'nʲi, teɪ ʎe'toʊɻ 'wanʲit͡ɕ eɪfʂ'ɻiet͡ɕ 'eɪt͡suɻ mɒ't͡ɕeɪ.je 'kielde]
Wejste nourd schi schwoura dejsptou kjera djejzar al our kal mejre petejrni, kjej keletoure wanic' ejfescherec' ejzur mâtjejje kjelde.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2021 7:12 am
by Otto Kretschmer
AFter we're done with Romanian, choose something that one can make a detailed gloss with, either a conlang or a natlang.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2021 12:54 am
by Rounin Ryuuji
  • [d͡ʑ t͡ɕ] > [d͡z t͡s] > [z s] before [e] and terminally; inherited [t͡s d͡z] also disaffricate;
  • Terminal consonants are frequently lost, with compensatory lengthening of the preceding vowel, or the syllabic element of a preceding diphthong; however this change is blocked, even across morpheme boundaries, where the consonant will often be lenited; syllable-final [s] disappears before another consonant internally with the same result, often also leniting whatever followed if a voiceless stop;
  • Insertion of a few more [ɪ] to break up unwieldy clusters
  • [k] > [c] > [ç] before [i]
['weːɪs noʊ ɕi ʂwoʊɻa zeːɪfɪ'toʊ 'çieɻa 'zeɪsaɻ͜ al͜ oːʊ kʷaː meɪ pɪeɪ'nʲi, teɪ ʎe'toːʊ 'wanʲiz eɪfɪ'ʂɻiez 'eɪsuː mɒ'seɪ.je 'çielde]
Wejste nourd schi schwoura dejfjtou hjera djejzar al our kal mejre pjejrni, tej ljetoure wanis' ejfjschres' ejzur mâtjejje hjelde.

Otto Kretschmer wrote: Sun Aug 22, 2021 7:12 am AFter we're done with Romanian, choose something that one can make a detailed gloss with, either a conlang or a natlang.
I have one. I translated the opening sequence from George MacDonald's Phantastes into Early Tinasan
More: show
在抂朝、期々意識堉乃復堉丹相林抂意芽津悗堉丹凬、吾荄起木。
Arŭasa, tokŏdokŏ isĭwokori no todori ni sŏfuru isime tsu moyori nite, wore nisekĕ
[áɺʉ̆̀ᵝ.áˑ.s̪à | t̪ʷóᵝˑ.kʷŏ̀ᵝ.d̪ʷóᵝ.kʷŏ̀ᵝ í.s̪ĭ̀.wóᵝ.kʷóᵝˑ.ɾ̪ʲì nòᵝ t̪ʷóᵝ.d̪óᵝˑ.ɾ̪ʲì ɲì s̪(ʷ)ŏ̀ᵝ.ɸʷʉ́ᵝˑ.ɺʉ̀ᵝ í.s̪íˑ.mɛ̀ t̪͡s̪ʲỳᵝ móᵝ.jóᵝ.ɾ̪ʲì ɲí.tɛ̀ | wóᵝˑ.ɺɛ̀ ɲíˑ.sɛ̀.kɛ̆̀]
certain.morning(=one morning) | instance.REDUPLICATED(=usual) mind.aware.INFINITIVE(=consciousness) GENITIVE return.INFINITIVE COMITATIVE accompany.ADNOMINAL mind CONNECTOR perplex.NOMINAL COMITATIVE | 1sg.NOMINATIVE awaken.PAST
Original: "I awoke one morning with the usual perplexity of mind which accompanies the return of consciousness."

The overshort vowels, noted with a breve, are unreduced, but held for about half the length of a normal syllable, while the most "prominent" high-pitched syllable also has half-lengthening; at this stage of the language, long vowels haven't yet developed, though /si/ and /ɕi/ are distinct sequences — the /si/ develops from earlier /ti/ through assibilation rather than affrication. The phones [yᵝ] and [ʉᵝ] are allophones of /u/, with [yᵝ] appearing after /j l/, in hiatus before /i/, and after palatals; there's also allophonic variation between [e] and [ɛ] (which follows roughly the same pattern), and also between [a], [æ], and [ɑ] (the last being triggered by labials and /w/), but this section doesn't give any examples. The affricate /ts/ is always at least somewhat palatalised, but does not tend to further palatalise (at this stage, anyway). Labialisation tends to be marginal or lost on /s/, and is not present on /j/, but /o/ will trigger it with most other consonants.

Anyway, have fun if you want to play with it; I'll follow Bradrn's method and just come in to change the structure when necessary, and maybe provide some influences from surrounding languages, which will all be near relations.

You can tell that it's in an archaic phase because it's written with an analogue of Man'yōgana. You can have some kana in place of the phonetic ones after a stage or two.

Re: Phrase evolution game

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2021 2:21 am
by bradrn
Rounin Ryuuji wrote: Mon Aug 23, 2021 12:54 am 在抂朝、期々意識堉乃復堉丹相林抂意芽津悗堉丹凬、吾荄起木。
Arŭasa, tokŏdokŏ isĭwokori no todori ni sŏfuru isime tsu moyori nite, wore nisekĕ
[áɺʉ̆̀ᵝ.áˑ.s̪à | t̪ʷóᵝˑ.kʷŏ̀ᵝ.d̪ʷóᵝ.kʷŏ̀ᵝ í.s̪ĭ̀.wóᵝ.kʷóᵝˑ.ɾ̪ʲì nòᵝ s̪(ʷ)ŏ̀ᵝ.ɸʷʉ́ᵝˑ.ɺʉ̀ᵝ í.s̪íˑ.mɛ̀ t̪͡s̪ʲỳᵝ móᵝ.jóᵝ.ɾ̪ʲì ɲí.tɛ̀ | wóᵝˑ.ɺɛ̀ ɲíˑ.sɛ̀.kɛ̆̀]
certain.morning(=one morning) | instance.REDUPLICATED(=usual) mind.aware.INFINITIVE(=consciousness) GENITIVE return.INFINITIVE COMITATIVE accompany.ADNOMINAL mind CONNECTOR perplex.NOMINAL COMITATIVE | 1sg.NOMINATIVE awaken.PAST
Original: "I awoke one morning with the usual perplexity of mind which accompanies the return of consciousness."
(Looks like you forgot to transcribe no todori — the IPA jumps straight from isĭwokori to ni sŏfuru. If you fix this I’ll edit my post.)
  1. Reduced vowels → [ɜ] or [ə] or [əᵝ]
  2. Compression → rounding except on [əᵝ]
  3. Half-long → long vowels (mostly a notational change)
  4. s̪ʷ ɸʷ → s̪ ʍ
  5. Palatalisation/labialisation/compression spreads through word
  6. sʲ s̪ʲ → ɕ; tʲ t̪͡s̪ kʲ → tɕ; kᶣ → tɕᶣ; sᵝ kᵝ → s͎ k͡p
  7. Vowels move into sets [æ ɛ i ɘ ɨ ə] ~ [ɒ ɞ ʉ o u ɵ] ~ [œ ø y ɵ ʉ ɵ] based on labialisation/palatalisation of surrounding consonants
在抂朝、期々意識堉乃復堉丹相林抂意芽津悗堉丹凬、吾荄起木。
Arŭasa, tokŏdokŏ isĭwokori no todori ni sŏfuru isime tsu moyori nite, wore nisekĕ
[áɺə̀ᵝ.áːs͎à | t̪ʷóːkʷə̀ᵝd̪ᵝók͡pə̀ᵝ íɕə̀͡ɵ̀ɥɵ́tɕᶣɵ́͡ɘ́ɾ̪ʲì nʷò t̪ʷód̪ʷó͡ɵ́ɾ̪ᶣỳ nʷò s̪ə̀͡ɵ̀ʍʉ́ːɺʷʉ̀ íɕíːmʲɛ̀ tɕᶣỳ mᶣɵ́ɥɵ́ɾ̪ᶣỳ͡ì ɲítɕɛ̀ | wóːɺʷɞ̀ ɲíːɕɛ̀tɕɜ̀]

Arŭasa,
certain.morning,
tokŏdokŏ
instance~REDUP
isĭwokori
mind.aware.INF
no
GEN
todori
return.INF
ni
COM
sŏfuru
accompany.ADN
isime
mind
tsu
CONN
moyori
perplex.NOM
nite,
COM,
wore
1SG.NOM
nisekĕ
awaken.PST