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Re: Luhansk vs Lugansk
Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2022 10:58 am
by Travis B.
Linguoboy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 10:15 am
I have mixed feelings about when governments--particularly those run by dictators or reactionary nationalists--insist on fixing the form of name used in foreign media. "Call people what they want to be called" is a basic principle of interpersonal politeness, but I'm not sure it scales up to this level--particularly when there's a disconnect between the regime and the folks they are supposedly representing. ("Myanmar" was an egregious example of this, with many folks insisting for years on using the previous exonym out of distaste for the military dictatorship.)
"Myanmar" is a classic example of this. I personally insist on
Burma for this very reason.
Re: Luhansk vs Lugansk
Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2022 2:10 pm
by Zju
Rounin Ryuuji wrote: ↑Tue Dec 06, 2022 4:46 pm
Zju wrote: ↑Tue Dec 06, 2022 3:27 pm
Rounin Ryuuji wrote: ↑Tue Dec 06, 2022 12:23 pm
Because exonyms don't exist, and we only speak of
Zhongguo,
Rossiya,
España,
Deutschland,
Nippon,
Italia, and so on.
Newsflash: nonstandard romanisations aren't exonyms.
Spelling a word slightly differently is
so much more extreme, isn't it?
I'm not sure why you think this is the case, but ok.
Re: Luhansk vs Lugansk
Posted: Wed Dec 07, 2022 2:46 pm
by Rounin Ryuuji
Zju wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 2:10 pm
Rounin Ryuuji wrote: ↑Tue Dec 06, 2022 4:46 pm
Zju wrote: ↑Tue Dec 06, 2022 3:27 pm
Newsflash: nonstandard romanisations aren't exonyms.
Spelling a word slightly differently is
so much more extreme, isn't it?
I'm not sure why you think this is the case, but ok.
It's sarcasm.
Re: Luhansk vs Lugansk
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 7:55 am
by Moose-tache
The Republic of China is a weird case, as its closest allies are the ones most insistent on never referring to it by it's official name, while its enemies will at least use part of the name.
Re: Luhansk vs Lugansk
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 2:47 pm
by Richard W
Linguoboy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 10:15 am
"Myanmar" was an egregious example of this, with many folks insisting for years on using the previous exonym out of distaste for the military dictatorship.
If you chase the etymology from
Burma at Wiktionary, you'll find that in origin,
Burma is just another form of
Myanmar. It dates back to the days when the initial cluster of the latter was pronounced /mr/, as it is still written in Burmese.
Re: Luhansk vs Lugansk
Posted: Thu Dec 08, 2022 2:54 pm
by Linguoboy
Richard W wrote: ↑Thu Dec 08, 2022 2:47 pm
Linguoboy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 07, 2022 10:15 am
"Myanmar" was an egregious example of this, with many folks insisting for years on using the previous exonym out of distaste for the military dictatorship.
If you chase the etymology from
Burma at Wiktionary, you'll find that in origin,
Burma is just another form of
Myanmar. It dates back to the days when the initial cluster of the latter was pronounced /mr/, as it is still written in Burmese.
Um, yeah, I'm aware of this. Many exonyms are cognate with the endonyms which replace them. (This is particularly common with the names of Indian cities, e.g. Bombay/Mumbai, Calcutta/Kolkata, Bangalore/Bengaluru.) I'm not sure what this has to do with sociopolitical ramifications of preferring one over the other in particular contexts.