Zompist Bboard Again

Space60 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 01, 2020 2:07 pm "mathematics, mathematical" Do you pronounce the "e" as a distinct syllable?

Yes, I do pronounce the “e”. I don’t think I’ve ever heard it pronounced without the “e”, although maybe I just haven’t been paying attention.

Space60 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 01, 2020 2:07 pm "mathematics, mathematical" Do you pronounce the "e" as a distinct syllable?

When I consider it after reading the question, it doesn't seem implausible that the second syllable could be phonetically elided in my speech. It's not something I noticed before. I would say that whichever way I pronounce "mathematics" and "mathematical" phonetically, they phonemically have a second syllable containing a reduced vowel, just like whichever way I pronounce "potato" or "parade" phonetically, they phonemically have a first syllable containing a reduced vowel.

That is, schwa deletion in mathematics/mathematical does not feel lexicalized for me the way it does in chocolate, temperature, family, camera, sophomore and separate (adj.). I think the lack of lexicalized schwa deletion for me in mathematical/mathematics might have to do with the position of the schwa immediately before a stressed syllable, but I'm not entirely certain. This slideshow might contain relevant information: https://btk.ppke.hu/uploads/articles/96 ... usters.pdf

Space60 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 01, 2020 2:07 pm "mathematics, mathematical" Do you pronounce the "e" as a distinct syllable?

I rarely say the full word, but I always delete the e: [maθmaʔɪks]

An assorted selection of obnoxious pronunciations.

akam chinjir [əˈkʰɑm ˈʃɪnʒɚ] (English hyperforeignism)
alice [aˈlitsə] (Old French)
bbbosborne [ˈbeɪbi ˈbɑsbɔɹn] (English)
dhok [dʱoːk] (Indo-Aryan)
bradrn [bɾaɖɳ̩] (Swedish, vaguely)
Frislander [fχislɒ̃ˈde] (French verb)
jal [xal] (Spanish)
Moose-tache [ˈmoːsə ˈtɑxə] (Dutch)
Raphael [rɔːfɔːˈʔeːl] (Tiberian reading of Biblical Hebrew)
Richard W [hiˈkaɾdu] (Portuguese)
thethief3 [fə ˈfif ˈfɹ̥i] (th-fronted English but with the [fə] due to assimilation)
tiramisu [tɕiɺámísu̥] (Japanese, in kunreisiki romanization)
TravisB [ˈtχavɪs ˈbeː] (German)
xxx [ɕː] (Mandarin pinyin)
Xwtek [ksv̩ˈtek] (international <x> [ks] with Germanic/Polish <w> [v])
Zju [θxu] (Spanish sound values)

I really like those — I think they’re really clever! I certainly would never have thought of that pronunciation for my username; I pronounce it roughly /ˈbɹædɑɹen/. (Although I actually see your interpretation as more reminiscent of Australian languages than Swedish, since Australian languages very commonly write /ɾ ɳ/ as ⟨r rn⟩).

Ser wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:59 am An assorted selection of obnoxious pronunciations.

akam chinjir [əˈkʰɑm ˈʃɪnʒɚ] (English hyperforeignism)
alice [aˈlitsə] (Old French)
bbbosborne [ˈbeɪbi ˈbɑsbɔɹn] (English)
dhok [dʱoːk] (Indo-Aryan)

How else were we supposed to be pronouncing this one?

New question: Has anyone ever heard Cyprus or Cypriot with initial /k/ in English?

Linguoboy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:41 am New question: Has anyone ever heard Cyprus or Cypriot with initial /k/ in English?

I am not sure if I have ever heard either of these pronounced in Real Life, but in my head I pronounce them both with initial /s/.

Linguoboy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:41 am

Ser wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:59 amdhok [dʱoːk] (Indo-Aryan)

How else were we supposed to be pronouncing this one?

[ðoʊk] (how he himself pronounces it). It's a clipped form of dhokarena [ˈðoʊkɑˌrɛnə], which is the name of his first conlang (or one of the first). IIRC it's a noun-noun compound where "dhoka" means 'man', but I've forgotten what "rena" means (I think it was some sort of animal).

Coming to think of it, my list of you're-not-doing-it-right pronunciation of forum members' names includes:

akam chinjir ['akam 't͡ʃind͡ʒiɾ]
dhok ['ðɔk]
Xwtek [x(ə)w'tɛk]
Nerulent ['njuːɾʊlent]; ['nɛwɾʏlent] (Dutch-ish pronunciation? not sure where I got the labialisation from)
mèþru ['meθɹu]
Whimemsz ['wɪmsɛz]
Vec (now former name) ['vɛt͡s]
Qwynegold ['kwinɛgold], ['kwɛnigold]

Some I misread on my first try, but that first pronunciation stuck in my head.

Ser wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:42 pm

Linguoboy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:41 am

Ser wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:59 amdhok [dʱoːk] (Indo-Aryan)

How else were we supposed to be pronouncing this one?

[ðoʊk] (how he himself pronounces it). It's a clipped form of dhokarena [ˈðoʊkɑˌrɛnə], which is the name of his first conlang (or one of the first). IIRC it's a noun-noun compound where "dhoka" means 'man', but I've forgotten what "rena" means (I think it was some sort of animal).

I always mentally pronounced these /doʊk/ [ˈtoʔk] and /ˌdoʊkəˈreɪnə/ [ˌtokʁ̩ːˈʁẽːɾ̃ə(ː)] respectively.

Zju wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:24 pm Coming to think of it, my list of you're-not-doing-it-right pronunciation of forum members' names includes:

akam chinjir ['akam 't͡ʃind͡ʒiɾ]
dhok ['ðɔk]
Xwtek [x(ə)w'tɛk]
Nerulent ['njuːɾʊlent]; ['nɛwɾʏlent] (Dutch-ish pronunciation? not sure where I got the labialisation from)
mèþru ['meθɹu]
Whimemsz ['wɪmsɛz]
Vec (now former name) ['vɛt͡s]
Qwynegold ['kwinɛgold], ['kwɛnigold]

Some I misread on my first try, but that first pronunciation stuck in my head.

I pronounce akam chinjir, dhok, mèþru the same way! How are those supposed to be pronounced?

(On the other hand, your pronunciation of Xwtek is nearly correct: Xwtek’s signature includes the pronunciation [xʷtɛ̀k].)

I never studied much Greek, but even so a W in a vocalic position makes me think of omega. And a 3 is /A/ because of Egyptology . (License plates, call signs etc) my pronunciations of names here are fairly close to an english/Spanish mix apart from that. I even pronounce my own name wrong by stressing the penult even though all Poswa and Pabappa words have initial syllable stress. I did the opposite way back when I was Mercator, and didn't learn the proper pronunciation until i went to a meetup where we greeted each other by screen name at first.

Pabappa wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:07 pmI did the opposite way back when I was Mercator, and didn't learn the proper pronunciation until i went to a meetup where we greeted each other by screen name at first.

Heavens to Mercator!

I'm pretty sure several people have now said over the years that they misread my name and pronounce it as though it were "Whimsesz"! (Unless that was also you, Zju, a while ago and I've forgotten.) Incidentally, even though it wasn't originally "supposed" to be pronounced this way, I now say it [wɪmɛmz] in my head; apparently my brain is too lazy to de-anglicize my own nick.

I vacillate between something like [ʌˈkɑm] and something like [ʌˈkɑ̃], and think I have [tʃɪˈndʒir], or would, if I were better at trilling. (The syllabic affiliation of the /n/ is a bit subtle; it's definitely not place-assimilated.)

Whimemsz wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:44 pm I'm pretty sure several people have now said over the years that they misread my name and pronounce it as though it were "Whimsesz"! (Unless that was also you, Zju, a while ago and I've forgotten.) Incidentally, even though it wasn't originally "supposed" to be pronounced this way, I now say it [wɪmɛmz] in my head; apparently my brain is too lazy to de-anglicize my own nick.

I’ve always said your username as some variant of /ˈwa͡im em es zed/ in my head. How was it originally “supposed” to be pronounced?

akam chinjir wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:05 pm I vacillate between something like [ʌˈkɑm] and something like [ʌˈkɑ̃], and think I have [tʃɪˈndʒir], or would, if I were better at trilling. (The syllabic affiliation of the /n/ is a bit subtle; it's definitely not place-assimilated.)

I’m curious to know: what language is your username supposed to be? (Or is it none in particular?)

No particular language, though it's not a coincidence that it starts with AKA.

bradrn wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 11:24 pm

Whimemsz wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:44 pmI'm pretty sure several people have now said over the years that they misread my name and pronounce it as though it were "Whimsesz"! (Unless that was also you, Zju, a while ago and I've forgotten.) Incidentally, even though it wasn't originally "supposed" to be pronounced this way, I now say it [wɪmɛmz] in my head; apparently my brain is too lazy to de-anglicize my own nick.

I’ve always said your username as some variant of /ˈwa͡im em es zed/ in my head. How was it originally “supposed” to be pronounced?

His username is a contorted amalgamation of the names of two dogs he had back in the day many years ago when he joined the ZBB, named Kaiser Wilhelm and Übermensch. Therefore it's supposed to be [ˈvɪmɪmʂ] (with the Polish value of <sz>). Although he sometimes says [ˈʍɪmɪmʂ], particularly in those days when he feels more Texan than normal.

(Yes, this is a joke. But note that what I said about dhok(arena) above is not a joke.)

Well, not entirely a joke, as you know. It WAS originally the names of my two dogs (not "Wilhelm" and "Übermensch") and squished together and then with some ~~EXOTIC COLORING~~ thrown on top because I was young and stupid and knew nothing about languages yet. That included not knowing anything about Polish or Hungarian so all I knew was that <sz> was a digraph found in a few languages, but not the sound value(s). It was originally supposed to be something like [ʍɪmɛmɕ].

/me should get two dogs - German shepherds obviously - and name them Wilhelm and Übermensch - lol