Zompist Bboard Again

Posted: **Tue Aug 11, 2020 10:41 am**

Maybe subconscious reading of it as a long "E" and trisyllabic laxing?

I dont really use the word naive much, and when I do it's usually with a dependent of some type. If i just want to call someone naive in an absolute sense I'll use a different word such as clueless.

I dont really distinguish between /a'i/ and /a'ji/ so cant really answer the main question here, and I dont use the words naiveté or naivety either. Though I would at least pronounce them "correctly' In the sense that the first ends with /e/ and the other ends with /i/.

Posted: **Tue Aug 11, 2020 10:43 am**

Pabappa wrote: ↑Tue Aug 11, 2020 10:41 am I dont really distinguish between /a'i/ and /a'ji/ so cant really answer the main question here…

Now that I think about it, I think that’s actually the situation with me as well. (Hence why I left my earlier answer a bit ambiguous as to whether I say [nɐˑˈiːv] or [nɐɪ̆ˈiːv].)

Posted: **Tue Aug 11, 2020 11:40 am**

naive: [nɑɪˈ(j)ɪ̞jv̥~næɪˈ(j)ɪ̞jv̥] (the variant with the FACE vowel is prob. either a sort of spelling pronunciation or due to the back New Zealand English realisation of FACE's first element)
naiveté: [nɑɪˈ(j)ɪ̞jvəˌtæɪ~nəˈ(j)ɪ̞jvəˌtæɪ]; maybe with [nɐ], but never with [-i]
naivety: Would use naiveté instead.

Posted: **Thu Aug 13, 2020 6:23 pm**

How do you pronounce?

"doll"
"dolly"
"dollar"
"moll"
"want"
"wanna"
"wash"
"wasp"
"water"
"watch"
"wallet"
"wand"
"wander"
"waffle"

Posted: **Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:45 pm**

doll: /dɑl/ [ta(ː)ɤ̯]
dolly: /ˈdɑli/ [ˈtaːɤ̯i(ː)]
dollar: /ˈdɑlər/ [ˈtaːɤ̯ʁ̩(ː)]
moll: /mɑl/ [ma(ː)ɤ̯]
want: /wɔnt/ [wɒ̃ʔ], or before a vowel, [wɒ̃ɾ̃]
wanna: /ˈwɔntə/ [ˈwɒ̃ɾ̃ə(ː)]~[wɒ̃ːə̯̃]
wash: /wɔʃ/ [wɒʃ]
wasp: /wɑsp/ [ˈwɑsʲp]
water: /ˈwɔtər/ [ˈwɒɾʁ̩(ː)]~[wɒːʁ]
watch: /wɔtʃ/ [wɒʔtʃ]
wallet: /ˈwɔlət/ [ˈwɒːo̯ɘʔ], or before a vowel, [ˈwɒːo̯ɘɾ]
wand: /wɑnd/ [wɑ̃ːnt]
wander: /ˈwɑndər/ [ˈwɑ̃ːndʁ̩(ː)]
waffle: /ˈwɑfəl/ [ˈwɑfɯ(ː)]

Posted: **Thu Aug 13, 2020 11:03 pm**

"doll" [dow]
"dolly" [ˈdɔɫiˑ]
"dollar" [ˈdɔɫɜ]
"moll" (not sure, although “mole” is [mow])
"want" [wɐntˢ]
"wanna" [ˈwɐnɐ ~ ˈwɐɾ̃ɐ]
"wash" [wɔʃ]
"wasp" [wɔsp]
"water" [ˈwoɾə]
"watch" [ˈwɔt͡ʃ]
"wallet" [ˈwɔɫətˢ]
"wand" [wɔnd]
"wander" [ˈwɐndɜ]
"waffle" [ˈwɔfɯ]

Posted: **Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:41 pm**

"doll" [dɒʟʷ]
"dolly" [ˈdɒli]
"dollar" [ˈdɒlə]
"moll" don't know this word - "mall" and "maul" are both [mɔːʟʷ]
"want" [wɒnʔ]
"wanna" [ˈwɒnə]
"wash" [wɒʃ]
"wasp" [wɒsp]
"water" [ˈwɔːʔə]
"watch" [wɒtʃ]
"wallet" [ˈwɒlɪʔ]
"wand" [wɒnd]
"wander" ['wɒndə]
"waffle" ['wɒfʊʟʷ]

Posted: **Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:14 pm**

What did you, as in "what did you say?", in everyday informal speech.

Posted: **Mon Aug 24, 2020 5:57 pm**

Travis B. wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:14 pm What did you, as in "what did you say?", in everyday informal speech.

[ˈwɐd.n̰̍.d͡ʑjɜ]

Posted: **Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:27 pm**

bradrn wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 5:57 pm
Travis B. wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:14 pm What did you, as in "what did you say?", in everyday informal speech.
[ˈwɐd.n̰̍.d͡ʑjɜ]

Why the [n̰̍]?

Posted: **Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:38 pm**

Travis B. wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:27 pm
bradrn wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 5:57 pm
Travis B. wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:14 pm What did you, as in "what did you say?", in everyday informal speech.
[ˈwɐd.n̰̍.d͡ʑjɜ]
Why the [n̰̍]?

From did. (I mentioned this earlier here, though I transcribed it somewhat differently.)

Posted: **Tue Aug 25, 2020 2:15 pm**

Travis B. wrote: ↑Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:14 pm What did you, as in "what did you say?", in everyday informal speech.

If the context is already past tense [ˈwɒʔdʒə], otherwise [ˈwɒɾɪdʒə]

Posted: **Mon Aug 31, 2020 9:35 am**

/ˈwʌ.dʒə/, I think.

Posted: **Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:38 pm**

Ser wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:13 am
Linguoboy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:58 pmTIL that Columbus, Ohio lies at the confluence of the Scioto and Olentangy rivers. I got the pronunciation of "Scioto" right on my second guess (my natural urge is to pronounce it as if it were Italian) but I munged "Olentangy". Let's see how the rest of you do!
I'd expect "Scioto" to be [saɪˈoʊtoʊ, ʃaɪ-, si-, ʃi-]. Possibly, but a lot less likely, with [-tə] or antepenultimate stress [ˈsaɪətoʊ, ˈʃaɪ-].

For "Olentangy", I'd expect [ˈoʊlənˌtʰæŋi, ˌɑɫ-], possibly, but a bit less likely, with [-ˌtʰɑŋ-].

I just remembered this, and when I looked them up I found /saɪˈoʊtoʊ/ and /oʊlənˈtændʒi/...

Posted: **Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:17 pm**

Do you pronounce "average" with /ɛ/? And if so, do you have the Mary-marry-merry merger too?

Posted: **Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:35 pm**

Ser wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:17 pm Do you pronounce "average" with /ɛ/? And if so, do you have the Mary-marry-merry merger too?

Which syllable are you asking about? “Average” is [ˈævɹɪ̈dʒ]~[ˈævəɹɪ̈dʒ].

Posted: **Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:56 pm**

Estav wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:35 pmWhich syllable are you asking about?

The stressed one.

Posted: **Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:05 pm**

Ser wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:17 pm Do you pronounce "average" with /ɛ/? And if so, do you have the Mary-marry-merry merger too?

/ˈævɻʷɘd͡ʒʷ/
/ˈme̞ːɻʷi/
/ˈmæɻʷi/
/ˈme̞ɻʷi/

So, no and no.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:22 pm**

Ser wrote: ↑Mon Aug 31, 2020 12:38 pm
Ser wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:13 am
Linguoboy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 18, 2020 2:58 pmTIL that Columbus, Ohio lies at the confluence of the Scioto and Olentangy rivers. I got the pronunciation of "Scioto" right on my second guess (my natural urge is to pronounce it as if it were Italian) but I munged "Olentangy". Let's see how the rest of you do!
I'd expect "Scioto" to be [saɪˈoʊtoʊ, ʃaɪ-, si-, ʃi-]. Possibly, but a lot less likely, with [-tə] or antepenultimate stress [ˈsaɪətoʊ, ˈʃaɪ-].

For "Olentangy", I'd expect [ˈoʊlənˌtʰæŋi, ˌɑɫ-], possibly, but a bit less likely, with [-ˌtʰɑŋ-].
I just remembered this, and when I looked them up I found /saɪˈoʊtoʊ/ and /oʊlənˈtændʒi/...

I'm from Columbus, where both of these names are sometimes treated as shibboleths. Your source is correct for "Olentangy" (in my social circles growing up its nickname was "the Old and Grungy"); for "Scioto" the pronunciation I'm used to is actually /saɪˈoʊtə/ (with a flapped /t/, of course).

Perhaps related: at a family funeral in Columbus a few years ago, I was struck by hearing the pastor pronounce "Chicago" /ʃɪˈkɔgə/. Is this variation familiar to anyone else?

(The history of those river names is kinda interesting too:

More: show

)

Ser wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:17 pm Do you pronounce "average" with /ɛ/? And if so, do you have the Mary-marry-merry merger too?

I pronounce it with /æ/, and don't think I've ever heard it otherwise (from a native English speaker, anyway). I do have that merger.

Posted: **Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:44 pm**

I live in New England, but Ive heard /ɔ/ in Chicago by people from there. The word-final /o/ > /ə/ thing is Appalachian (the same people who shift /ə/ > /i/) but could have spread out at least sporadically.

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