Zompist Bboard Again

I think you'll probably enjoy this site: https://atlas.limsi.fr/?tab=map
First for their stubborn committment to 90s web design, second for their insanely detailed map of Oïl and Occitan dialects, with a recording of 'The North Wind and the Sun' in each of them.

Other tabs cover creoles, sign languages, and a pretty good survey of regional languages in Europe.

(As a conlanger, I think it's extremely depressing. I had plan to do a survey of Simbri dialects -- covering an area about the size of France -- but I think I'll go whimper under the bed instead.)

This is seriously impressive. Not only do they have an, as you say, insanely detailed map of both Oïl and Oc, they also have a remarkably comprehensive set of languages from elsewhere in the world, including Basque (two dialects), several Berber languages, and quite a few New Caledonian and Polynesian languages, amongst others. My only complaints are that it’s non-obvious how to stop audio (do it by clicking on a blank area of the map), it’s all in French (the English translation seems to auto-disable itself), and a couple of the transcriptions don’t quite line up with the audio (a common problem for these sorts of things).

I'm not entirely sure how they decide between showing the official status and showing the de facto situation. For instance, they show all of the Republic of Ireland, but none of Northern Ireland, as "Irish Gaelic" speaking, all of Wales as Welsh speaking, and fairly large parts of Scotland as Scottish Gaelic speaking - by what standard?

Raphael wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 10:07 am I'm not entirely sure how they decide between showing the official status and showing the de facto situation. For instance, they show all of the Republic of Ireland, but none of Northern Ireland, as "Irish Gaelic" speaking, all of Wales as Welsh speaking, and fairly large parts of Scotland as Scottish Gaelic speaking - by what standard?

They go by the historical extent of the language/dialect. It's entirely possible they got Britain and Ireland wrong!

Who knew France was secretly New Guinea? I swear to God I heard ejectives.

Moose-tache wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 10:32 am Who knew France was secretly New Guinea? I swear to God I heard ejectives.

Oh, where did you hear these? I'm not aware that we have any.

Moose-tache wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 10:32 am Who knew France was secretly New Guinea? I swear to God I heard ejectives.

But what do ejectives have to do with New Guinea? WALS shows no New Guinean language with ejectives. Rather, I'd associate ejectives with the Caucasus.

WeepingElf wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 11:01 am

Moose-tache wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 10:32 am Who knew France was secretly New Guinea? I swear to God I heard ejectives.

But what do ejectives have to do with New Guinea? WALS shows no New Guinean language with ejectives. Rather, I'd associate ejectives with the Caucasus.

I believe Moose refers to language diversity. (Though we don't have as many language families!)

Ares Land wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 11:24 am

WeepingElf wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 11:01 am

Moose-tache wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 10:32 am Who knew France was secretly New Guinea? I swear to God I heard ejectives.

But what do ejectives have to do with New Guinea? WALS shows no New Guinean language with ejectives. Rather, I'd associate ejectives with the Caucasus.

I believe Moose refers to language diversity. (Though we don't have as many language families!)

Maybe. But the Caucasus is also famed for its linguistic diversity, even if it doesn't even get close to New Guinea - and most of its languages have ejectives, which doesn't seem to be the case with New Guinea.

But as we are at regional languages of France: does anyone know good resources for Lorrain?

WeepingElf wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 3:12 pm But as we are at regional languages of France: does anyone know good resources for Lorrain?

It seems to me Oïl languages are under-studied, so not really.
How good is your French, though?

You can check this: https://gallica.bnf.fr/services/engine/ ... &suggest=0
Mostly XIXth century surveys with all proper caveats, but there doesn't seem to be anything more recent, at least at this level of depth.

WeepingElf wrote: ↑Tue May 10, 2022 3:12 pm But as we are at regional languages of France: does anyone know good resources for Lorrain?

I've checked the Oxford guide to the Romance languages, and their main referrences for Lorrain are Atlas linguistique et ethnographique de la Lorraine romane by Lanher, Litaize and Richard which looks very promising but isn't available online, and Le parler rural de Ranrupt (Bas-Rhin) by Gertrud Aub-Büscher (which is even less available online). As for stuff actually online, Adam's Les Patois Lorrains is very dated but probably still the best you'll find.