Should I bother to try reading G. K. Chesterton?

[Ares Land]

I don't deny he was influential at one point - I even tried reading one of his books (couldn't get past a couple chapters) but his popularity lasted, what, a few years? I think he's forgotten now. That said, I don't really follow what's going on in the manosphere.

[rotting bones]

I don't deny he was influential at one point - I even tried reading one of his books (couldn't get past a couple chapters) but his popularity lasted, what, a few years? I think he's forgotten now. That said, I don't really follow what's going on in the manosphere.

I don't think that his popularity last now that he's a vegetable. I think his popularity had a lot to do with his speaking voice: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL22J ... rqKY8wPPmk

At the height of his popularity, he was much bigger than Chesterton though.

The reason I say Chesterton is like Jordan Peterson is not because of his popularity, but because they both:

1. Promoted socially conservative causes.
2. Wanted society to be based on Christianity.
3. Discouraged people from taking effective action against injustice.
4. Told people to work on their personal relationships and immediate surroundings instead. (Note that I agree with them that it's important to touch grass. I just don't think touching grass is a replacement for fighting Sauron, as Gandalf understood when he said Tom Bombadil will not be able to resist when Mordor comes knocking.)
5. Promoted respect for social hierarchies, though both had weird interpretations of what that meant, especially Chesterton.
...

[rotting bones]

I have to say, though, Jordan Peterson literally tried to argue that if everyone in North Korea cleaned their room more, the dictatorship will fall. No protests necessary. I don't think Chesterton was explicitly that big of an idiot.

[zompist]

What they have in common is that they both wanted society to be based on Christianity. One difference is that for Jordan Peterson, it was a crank's New Age fever dream version of Christianity.

As opposed to Chesterton who had a crank's Middle Ages fever dream version of Christianity.

That's not entirely fair but also not entirely unfair. A lot of intellectuals were attracted to Catholicism from a sense that it was earthy, a matter of body as well as spirit-- as opposed to what can seem the airy-mindedness of Protestantism. Father Brown is always surprising people precisely because he is not saintly and otherworldly. On the other hand, Chesterton's ideas of happy medievality are pretty much claptrap. He was a thoroughly urban modern, didn't even bother to go live in a hovel somewhere.

(A lot of the same thing is found in Tolkien, where people mostly find it charming. And it is, if you don't take it seriously as a description of how people ought to live.)

[zompist]

3. Discouraged people from taking effective action against injustice.

That is not true-- at least of the early Chesterton. He speaks approvingly of the occasional revolution. His "distributism" is far from a vision of maintaining the hierarchy of his time, much less today's plutocracy.

[rotting bones]

That is not true-- at least of the early Chesterton. He speaks approvingly of the occasional revolution. His "distributism" is far from a vision of maintaining the hierarchy of his time, much less today's plutocracy.

From Chesterton, I'm thinking of comments where he tried to convince people to love their neighbors before worrying about society, said that the biggest revolt is revolting against revolt itself, etc. I don't expect either of them to be consistent. Jordan Peterson was against protesting. He became a millionaire protesting trans rights.

[rotting bones]

I've also seen good advice from both of them, even Jordan Peterson: https://youtu.be/CqutgfBIuMw?si=CAgcGgtlU_YC0f0L

[Raphael]

He has 8 million subscribers on Youtube, so he must be a shadow of his former self.

He has been annoying his viewers for a long time. Like I said, now he is a vegetable. 8 million people are subscribed to a vegetable.

In today's world, I wouldn't even be surprised about 8 million people subscribing to an actual vegetable. ("Follow our TikTok channel about the whacky adventures of our pet carrot!")

[bradrn]

He has 8 million subscribers on Youtube, so he must be a shadow of his former self.

He has been annoying his viewers for a long time. Like I said, now he is a vegetable. 8 million people are subscribed to a vegetable.

In today's world, I wouldn't even be surprised about 8 million people subscribing to an actual vegetable. ("Follow our TikTok channel about the whacky adventures of our pet carrot!")

Well, there was The Lettuce…

[Raphael]

He has been annoying his viewers for a long time. Like I said, now he is a vegetable. 8 million people are subscribed to a vegetable.

In today's world, I wouldn't even be surprised about 8 million people subscribing to an actual vegetable. ("Follow our TikTok channel about the whacky adventures of our pet carrot!")

Well, there was The Lettuce…

Hah! Thank you for telling me!

[rotting bones]

Who was the famous British Catholic convert who cited the Opium Wars as a major reason for his conversion, Henry Newman?

[Raphael]

Who was the famous British Catholic convert who cited the Opium Wars as a major reason for his conversion, Henry Newman?

Dunno - all I know is that a word search for "opium" on his Wikipedia page doesn't produce anything.