Names, nouns and their (phonological) restrictions

[xxx]

in 3SDeduciveLanguage(1Sense=1Sign=1Sound),
there's no question of importing mouth sounds to name anything...
translation is de rigueur,
and the contemporary practice of names that mean nothing is out of the question...

Ah...so, in that case, when we're talking to you, we can call you Triple Pirate Palmtree ? On a map, thats what your username would equate to.

this is not a valid translation in 3SDL...

[Ares Land]

Speaking of which, I ran into my second Gwenael (oubien Gwenaël} this past weekend, and like the first, he was a Parisian with no clear ties to Bretagne. Was there just a momentary toquade for Breton names in the Métropole in the 80s?

Yep; Breton names have been popular since they were allowed (I think in the 70s? though Google says 1966). Gwenaël was pretty popular for my generation, as were Erwann and Loïc. Yann and variants were popular in the 70s.
Maël/Maëlle and variants are very popular now I think.

I don't know why Erwann is okay but Fañch threatens Republican unity. The explanation probably involves dark bits of human psychology, so I don't really want to know.

There was a brief period when you could blame computers for not supporting diacritics etc., but that time is past.

And anyways, anyone who writes a system that won't accept arbitrary UTF-8 ought to be ashamed of themselves.

I had a weird incident with Ryanair a few years ago; apparently their booking system still expected ASCII, and we were almost refused boarding (Apparently the boarding clerk thought it was our fault somehow, or that there are French names spelled with é and that we were trying to get away with identity theft?)

[xxx]

Yep; Breton names have been popular since they were allowed (I think in the 70s? though Google says 1966). Gwenaël was pretty popular for my generation, as were Erwann and Loïc. Yann and variants were popular in the 70s.
Maël/Maëlle and variants are very popular now I think.

ah the era of the return of traditional folk music...

I don't know why Erwann is okay but Fañch threatens Republican unity.

just orthographic issue (imagine ideograms or con-characters)...
you'd be surprised at the computerized coding of names by the states...
choosing such a name is just an sectarian/activist's individual will,
ready/satisfied to bear the consequences in everyday life...
(or to make their child endure them)

[Ares Land]

just orthographic issue (imagine ideograms or con-characters)...
you'd be surprised at the computerized coding of names by the states...
choosing such a name is just an sectarian/activist's individual will,
ready/satisfied to bear the consequences in everyday life...
(or to make their child endure them)

'Computerized coding'? Whatever software/database combination will handle UTF-8 just fine. The French state has antique systems in places -- but these are going to use a variant of iso-latin-1, which handles ñ just fine.

On the rest... Are we sure the parents are sectarian or activists? Personally, I'm not so sure. (Some friends went for far more difficult names for their children; as it happens, they're just regular folks)
Assuming they are activists (which is possible), what's wrong with being a Breton enthusiasts?
As for consequences... there won't be any, not of any importance. The kid will have to correct the spelling once in a while -- something which happens to me all the time and I have a very straightforward name with a very straightforward orthography

No, honestly, deep down it's just a civil servant being a dick.

[xxx]

'Computerized coding'? Whatever software/database combination will handle UTF-8 just fine. The French state has antique systems in places -- but these are going to use a variant of iso-latin-1, which handles ñ just fine.

believe me, I know a little about how it works, even if it's not precisely on this point, but we're far from it...

On the rest... Are we sure the parents are sectarian or activists?

but I understand that minorities called upon as they are to assert a right that opposes the majority,
that the concept of activism is no longer suitable to depict them,
the truth, and its dick, is probably elsewhere...

[Raphael]

but I understand that minorities called upon as they are to assert a right that opposes the majority,
that the concept of activism is no longer suitable to depict them,
the truth, and its dick, is probably elsewhere...

I'm not sure I understand correctly what you're saying there, but - are you saying that it's fundamentally wrong for minorities to assert rights??

[xxx]

I believe in the importance of minorities to build a majority,
but I think it's fundamentally wrong to use minorities to dissolve a majority...

I claim the right to use my conlang, in conscript,
but I can't limit myself to these means in my social interactions...

[keenir]

I believe in the importance of minorities to build a majority,
but I think it's fundamentally wrong to use minorities to dissolve a majority...

Dissolve? could you please clarify what you mean there? is it...

1) accusing minorities of dilluting and weakening society like a normal Fifth Column?
2) saying underrepresented groups shouldn't be expecting protection from mobs and injustice?
3) stating that small states shouldn't be upset that larger states have greater voting power, and that if the large states don't have greater voting power, they should?
4) quoting that there is no spoon.
5) saying that members of a coalition or other political agreement, can never leave that coalition ever.
6) Other.

[xxx]

6) other :

I claim the right to use my conlang, in conscript,
but I can't limit myself to these means in my social interactions...

[keenir]

6) other :

I claim the right to use my conlang, in conscript,
but I can't limit myself to these means in my social interactions...

what does that have to do with dissolving?

[Linguoboy]

6) other :

I claim the right to use my conlang, in conscript,
but I can't limit myself to these means in my social interactions...

Yeah, because using a conlang you invented as an adult is exactly like using the vernacular that has been the community language of your native place since long before your birth and far longer than currently dominant variety.

I can see the advantages for enforcing a uniform language policy of treating all languages of France other than Standard French as conlangs. You just have to ignore all historical, cultural, social, and linguistic facts and things become quite simple.

[Travis B.]

6) other :

I claim the right to use my conlang, in conscript,
but I can't limit myself to these means in my social interactions...

Yeah, because using a conlang you invented as an adult is exactly like using the vernacular that has been the community language of your native place since long before your birth and far longer than currently dominant variety.

I can see the advantages for enforcing a uniform language policy of treating all languages of France other than Standard French as conlangs. You just have to ignore all historical, cultural, social, and linguistic facts and things become quite simple.

'The language of the republic is French' is frankly horrible and anyone who thinks that it is a good idea is someone who wants to stomp out any local language or culture in favor of homogenizing uniformity. I have no sympathy with anyone who believes this is a good thing.

[Travis B.]

And yes, this is why I insist on speaking the English variety I grew up with throughout everyday life, including at work, even if it means that others (particularly non-native English-speakers) have to exert a little more effort on their part, because I don't believe that non-standard varieties ought to be limited to the home.

[Raphael]

'The language of the republic is French' is frankly horrible and anyone who thinks that it is a good idea is someone who wants to stomp out any local language or culture in favor of homogenizing uniformity. I have no sympathy with anyone who believes this is a good thing.

And it's quite ironic coming from French people, given how much they often value protecting their national language and culture against global homogenizing uniformity.

[Travis B.]

'The language of the republic is French' is frankly horrible and anyone who thinks that it is a good idea is someone who wants to stomp out any local language or culture in favor of homogenizing uniformity. I have no sympathy with anyone who believes this is a good thing.

And it's quite ironic coming from French people, given how much they often value protecting their national language and culture against global homogenizing uniformity.

And especially since in areas like food production France pushes hard on things like AOC's and like.

[xxx]

'The language of the republic is French'

this is typical of ubris of French Age of Enlightenment
to think that its values ​​are universal
and its duty to spread them,
nowadays it is the US which carry this incendiary torch...

treating all languages of France other than Standard French as conlangs. You just have to ignore all historical, cultural, social, and linguistic facts and things become quite simple.

my God no, I identify with my conlang as being what I am,
in a purely free way and without the need for recognition,
even if I don't use it to communicate with others,
and because I don't want that the others use it either,

I regret that the natural languages need to be valued
in particular financially so as not to be forgotten,
as if bilingualism were a defect when it is a benefit ...

every language we carry deserves to be strengthened
and it is normal that it is able to translate everything
including names for its use...

[Ares Land]

Breton first names are perfectly legal, by the way, including Fañch.
Apparently a couple of judges and registrars felt unduly threatened, but their decision was overturned.

One thing I noticed (and this might be universal!) is that people can be weirdly judgemental when it comes to how you name your kids.

[Raphael]

One thing I noticed (and this might be universal!) is that people can be weirdly judgemental when it comes to how you name your kids.

Well, I do think that naming your kid, say, "Stupid Idiot" would be a form of child abuse. Not sure if that's what you have in mind, though.

[Ares Land]

One thing I noticed (and this might be universal!) is that people can be weirdly judgemental when it comes to how you name your kids.

Well, I do think that naming your kid, say, "Stupid Idiot" would be a form of child abuse. Not sure if that's what you have in mind, though.

No, not at all
What I noticed is that people tend to think that giving a child a name that is even vaguely out of the ordinary, and that they personally don't like is some sort of terrible disservice.

When I was a kid, the worst name you give to your child was Kevin. It was seen as stupid, a stereotypical white trash name and perhaps worst of all, American. People named Kevin tend to be about my age and as it happens, they turned out fine. (As it happens, the few Kevins I worked with were important executive peoplen, so the name might be any of these things but not white trash.)

Or you know -- and this might be difficult for many of us -- naming your child Khaleesi. Not a name I'd chose, but the little Khaleesis will turn out fine.

[xxx]

Breton first names are perfectly legal, by the way, including Fañch.
Apparently a couple of judges and registrars felt unduly threatened, but their decision was overturned.

the decision was overturned only because of a procedural error (the height of judicialization...),
all other attempts, including allowing diacritics by law, have been rejected, even at European level...

Fortunately, you can name your children whatever you/they like without having to register them...

and I know people who use a nickname pronounced like their first name in a foreign language, in a commercial context...

for a conlanger a priori, the pleasure of translations, including in the natworld, always delights me...