United States Politics Thread 46

[Raholeun]

I'd wish them all death but death would be too sparing a fate for what they deserve

We absolutely HATE HATE HATE everybody who is not as loving and tolerant as we are.

[Emily]

Unless the last uncounted votes decisively turn for Harris, to all those who voted for Trump, I really hope you enjoy the dictatorship you've chosen. Unfortunately everyone else has to enjoy it too, and not just you alone. Each and every American eligible to vote who did not vote for Harris should be considered personally responsible for what comes next. If you were too stupid or too ignorant to realize what Trump will to do this country a second time around, it is still your fault.

once again the democrats' loss is everyone's fault except the democrats. shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

[Raphael]

shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

When people act in a way that might well end up significantly shortening my life, I don't see why I should be nice and respectful towards them.

[Raphael]

I'd wish them all death but death would be too sparing a fate for what they deserve

We absolutely HATE HATE HATE everybody who is not as loving and tolerant as we are.

There is no contradiction between being loving and tolerant towards the loving and tolerant, and being hateful towards the hateful.

[Travis B.]

I'd wish them all death but death would be too sparing a fate for what they deserve

We absolutely HATE HATE HATE everybody who is not as loving and tolerant as we are.

There is no contradiction between being loving and tolerant towards the loving and tolerant, and being hateful towards the hateful.

Actually, this is necessary for tolerance to survive. If we are tolerant to the intolerant, the intolerant will take over and will wipe out tolerance (i.e. the paradox of tolerance).

[Raholeun]

All this "hate the nonbeliever" stuff rings quite fascist to me, tbh.

[Travis B.]

Unless the last uncounted votes decisively turn for Harris, to all those who voted for Trump, I really hope you enjoy the dictatorship you've chosen. Unfortunately everyone else has to enjoy it too, and not just you alone. Each and every American eligible to vote who did not vote for Harris should be considered personally responsible for what comes next. If you were too stupid or too ignorant to realize what Trump will to do this country a second time around, it is still your fault.

once again the democrats' loss is everyone's fault except the democrats. shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

Umm it was very obvious what the Republicans stood/stand for and what they were planning to do (the Republicans did nothing to hide it), so anyone who could vote and didn't vote for Harris frankly was/is necessarily either stupid/ignorant (i.e. they didn't realize what Trump was/is for and was/is planning to do or were somehow deluded into thinking it was a good thing) or evil (i.e. they knew full well what Trump intended and how bad it would be and supported it because of that). And you are just making excuses for them with statements like that.

[Travis B.]

All this "hate the nonbeliever" stuff rings quite fascist to me, tbh.

Are you referring to the position that the people who could vote and didn't vote for Harris are either stupid/ignorant or evil or to the idea of the paradox of intolerance? In the first case there was a definite, objective morally right choice and morally wrong choice, and these people made the morally wrong choice. In the other case if the intolerant are tolerated, they take over and dominate until tolerance is eliminated.

[Raphael]

All this "hate the nonbeliever" stuff rings quite fascist to me, tbh.

I can't speak for Ahzoh, but I myself don't hate people for being "nonbelievers"; I might hate or dislike them for being complete asshats. There might well be no single other person in the world who has the exact same combination of political opinions as me, so if I'd hate everyone who disagrees with me about something political, I'd probably have to hate everyone.

[Mornche Geddick]

As Zompist said after 9/11:

I also believe that everybody is allowed to say something stupid this week. Nerves and emotions are going to be running raw.

[Ahzoh]

I'd wish them all death but death would be too sparing a fate for what they deserve

We absolutely HATE HATE HATE everybody who is not as loving and tolerant as we are.

They don't have to be loving and tolerant, they just have to not be braindead stupid enough to give power to the leopard that will either not give them what they want or eat their face off. They will reap what they sow and suffer for it, but unfortunately, now we must also

[Ahzoh]

All this "hate the nonbeliever" stuff rings quite fascist to me, tbh.

And that sentiment is based only on vibes, not anything actual

We once again must refer to the meme:

GUc3H57XgAAA-Pg.jpg (125.33 KiB) Viewed 131 times

[Ares Land]

All this "hate the nonbeliever" stuff rings quite fascist to me, tbh.

I think people here see the racism, misogyny, the 'fuck you got mine' attitude, and remember the half-farce half-coup Capitol thing. I believe it's understandable that people might get angry at that?
I'd really like to know what people really see in Trump -- is it just that they find the racism appealing? Or are there other factors? Is it the economy? But it's not like 2016-2020 really made America great again, or did it?

once again the democrats' loss is everyone's fault except the democrats. shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

It looks like every one hates a loser: people on every social media are compiling a list of what Harris should said or been instead.
I was open to the idea that Trump won the first time around because the Democrats sucked. Less so this time; people were quite aware of what they were voting for and, judging by the lead Trump has (as Raphael mentioned) they seemed pretty enthusiastic about it.

Coming back to my question above, it also depends of what people like about it. I'm afraid people seem to enjoy the trolling and the racism and people storming the Capitol in weird hats. I'd be really happy to be proven wrong!

[Raphael]

Or are there other factors? Is it the economy? But it's not like 2016-2020 really made America great again, or did it?

OK, just to make this clear, none of what I'm about to write is meant as a defense of any Trump voters. It's just a bit of psychological speculation.

That said,

over the last five years, first because of Covid-19 and then because of Ukraine, there was a lot of inflation. Now, the Biden Administration seems to have gotten that under control eventually in the USA. But, problem is, for all too many people, the word "inflation" seems to mean simply "stuff costs more than it used to". That means that they won't perceive inflation as under control as long as stuff still costs more than it used to. Sigh.

[Man in Space]

I found this series of slides illuminating.

shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

Giving everyone a vote means letting the poorly-educated vote. It always seemed odd to me that the same people who lionize democracy openly insult those without education. Like, the poorly-educated are going to have a vote, and instead of reaching out to them, you (the general “you”, not you specifically) just demonize them. Small wonder they vote for the party that doesn’t practice open intellectual snobbery and bullying against them. (I still remember 2016, when Clinton called half the country a “basket of deplorable”, while Trump said “I love the poorly-educated”.)

All this "hate the nonbeliever" stuff rings quite fascist to me, tbh.

And that sentiment is based only on vibes, not anything actual

[citation needed]

[WeepingElf]

We once again must refer to the meme:
GUc3H57XgAAA-Pg.jpg

Yep.

[doctor shark]

I'm unfortunately not surprised by the overall result given some recent election trends on this side of the Atlantic (e.g. the Netherlands, Austria, various German states, France...), given how a lot of electoral events occur in waves. I'm also not surprised by control of the Senate flipping (particularly since West Virgin(ia)'s Senate seat was all but forfeit to the Republicans). What I'm perhaps more surprised by is the margin by which it happened and particularly given many polling numbers indicated things would be much closer than they actually were/are. Alas, though, it looks like I'm picking up the pace for my project to obtain a Luxembourgish passport next year...

[Travis B.]

shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

Giving everyone a vote means letting the poorly-educated vote. It always seemed odd to me that the same people who lionize democracy openly insult those without education. Like, the poorly-educated are going to have a vote, and instead of reaching out to them, you (the general “you”, not you specifically) just demonize them. Small wonder they vote for the party that doesn’t practice open intellectual snobbery and bullying against them. (I still remember 2016, when Clinton called half the country a “basket of deplorable”, while Trump said “I love the poorly-educated”.)

Is it "open intellectual snobbery and bullying" to expect people to be just slightly informed (e.g. occasionally opening Google News and reading about politics or even just turning on any TV channel other than Fox News every so often), to be angry when they either patently ignore everything that comes directly out of their chosen candidate's own mouth right in the very open, in the kind of media that they themselves are likely to follow (i.e. they are ignorant) or actively agree with it and think it is good (i.e. they are evil)?

[Man in Space]

shocking that calling people stupid and ignorant didn't win them over to your side

Giving everyone a vote means letting the poorly-educated vote. It always seemed odd to me that the same people who lionize democracy openly insult those without education. Like, the poorly-educated are going to have a vote, and instead of reaching out to them, you (the general “you”, not you specifically) just demonize them. Small wonder they vote for the party that doesn’t practice open intellectual snobbery and bullying against them. (I still remember 2016, when Clinton called half the country a “basket of deplorable”, while Trump said “I love the poorly-educated”.)

Is it "open intellectual snobbery and bullying" to expect people to be just slightly informed (e.g. occasionally opening Google News and reading about politics or even just turning on any TV channel other than Fox News every so often), to be angry when they either patently ignore everything that comes directly out of their chosen candidate's own mouth right in the very open, in the kind of media that they themselves are likely to follow (i.e. they are ignorant) or actively agree with it and think it is good (i.e. they are evil)?

If one party constantly bangs their drum to shit on you for your (lack of) education, would you care what the other does so long as they embraced you? EDIT: Put another way—if one party makes it clear they despise you, why would you be inclined to vote for them?

[Travis B.]

Giving everyone a vote means letting the poorly-educated vote. It always seemed odd to me that the same people who lionize democracy openly insult those without education. Like, the poorly-educated are going to have a vote, and instead of reaching out to them, you (the general “you”, not you specifically) just demonize them. Small wonder they vote for the party that doesn’t practice open intellectual snobbery and bullying against them. (I still remember 2016, when Clinton called half the country a “basket of deplorable”, while Trump said “I love the poorly-educated”.)

Is it "open intellectual snobbery and bullying" to expect people to be just slightly informed (e.g. occasionally opening Google News and reading about politics or even just turning on any TV channel other than Fox News every so often), to be angry when they either patently ignore everything that comes directly out of their chosen candidate's own mouth right in the very open, in the kind of media that they themselves are likely to follow (i.e. they are ignorant) or actively agree with it and think it is good (i.e. they are evil)?

If one party constantly bangs their drum to shit on you for your (lack of) education, would you care what the other does so long as they embraced you? EDIT: Put another way—if one party makes it clear they despise you, why would you be inclined to vote for them?

You seem to expect the Democrats to prostrate themselves before the Republican base and never say anything that may slightly offend them while the Republicans constantly shit on anything left of, well, far-right with impunity.