Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Conworlds and conlangs
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

dewrad wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 10:18 pm
bradrn wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 7:23 pm(By the way, I’m just wondering: where did you get the names from?)
Really?
Well, yes, of course it’s obvious that the first is from ‘Pheasant’, the next is from ‘Robin’ etc… I’m just wondering if there was any particular logic behind Birdlang’s choice of those specific names.
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

I’ve finished the others:

Plymouth:

⟨a e i o u v w y⟩ /a e i o u v̩ ɯ y/
⟨ā ē ī ō ū v̄ w̄ ȳ⟩ /aː eː iː oː uː v̩ː ɯː yː/

⟨m n ŋ̇ ŋ ˀ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ ʔ/
⟨p t č k⟩ /p t c k/
⟨b d ǰ g⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ/
⟨ƀ đ ϑ ǥ⟩ /ɓ ɗ ʄ ɠ/
⟨s š h⟩ /s ʃ h/
⟨z ž ˁ⟩ /z ʒ ʕ~ɦ/
⟨r l ɬ⟩ /r l ɬ/

Cotaili:

⟨ä e ö i ü a o u⟩ /æ e ø i y ɑ o u/
⟨â ē ô ī û ā ō ū⟩ /æː eː øː iː yː ɑː oː uː/

⟨m n ñ ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t k⟩ /p t k/
⟨b d g⟩ /b d ɡ/
⟨c č j⟩ /t͡s t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/
⟨f s š x h⟩ /f s ʃ x h/
⟨v z ž ɣ⟩ /v z ʒ ɣ/
⟨l ł⟩ /l ɫ/
⟨r y ẏ w⟩ /r j ɰ w/

Fake Spanish:

⟨i ü ꞷ u⟩ /i y ɯ u/
⟨ï ʊ⟩ /ɪ ʊ/
⟨e ə ʉ o⟩ /e ə ɵ o/
⟨ɛ œ ʌ ɔ⟩ /ɛ œ ʌ ɔ/
⟨æ a⟩ /æ ɑ/

⟨m n ň ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t ť k ǩ q⟩ /p t c k q ʔ/
⟨b d ď g ǧ⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ ɢ/
⟨c č⟩ /t͡s t͡ʃ/
⟨f s š x ẍ h⟩ /f s ʃ x χ h/
⟨ʋ v z ž⟩ /ʋ v z ʒ/
⟨r ř y ȳ w⟩ /ɾ r j ɰ w/
⟨l ľ⟩ /l ʎ/

I’m a bit uncertain about some of these, particularly Plymouth ⟨v v̄⟩, Fake Spanish ⟨ť ǩ ď ǧ ʋ⟩, and pretty much the whole of the Fake Spanish vowel system (which seems just slightly too big to be plausible), but overall I’m fairly happy about most of this.
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

bradrn wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 9:10 am I’ve finished the others:

Plymouth:

⟨a e i o u v w y⟩ /a e i o u v̩ ɯ y/
⟨ā ē ī ō ū v̄ w̄ ȳ⟩ /aː eː iː oː uː v̩ː ɯː yː/

⟨m n ŋ̇ ŋ ˀ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ ʔ/
⟨p t č k⟩ /p t c k/
⟨b d ǰ g⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ/
⟨ƀ đ ϑ ǥ⟩ /ɓ ɗ ʄ ɠ/
⟨s š h⟩ /s ʃ h/
⟨z ž ˁ⟩ /z ʒ ʕ~ɦ/
⟨r l ɬ⟩ /r l ɬ/

Cotaili:

⟨ä e ö i ü a o u⟩ /æ e ø i y ɑ o u/
⟨â ē ô ī û ā ō ū⟩ /æː eː øː iː yː ɑː oː uː/

⟨m n ñ ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t k⟩ /p t k/
⟨b d g⟩ /b d ɡ/
⟨c č j⟩ /t͡s t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/
⟨f s š x h⟩ /f s ʃ x h/
⟨v z ž ɣ⟩ /v z ʒ ɣ/
⟨l ł⟩ /l ɫ/
⟨r y ẏ w⟩ /r j ɰ w/

Fake Spanish:

⟨i ü ꞷ u⟩ /i y ɯ u/
⟨ï ʊ⟩ /ɪ ʊ/
⟨e ə ʉ o⟩ /e ə ɵ o/
⟨ɛ œ ʌ ɔ⟩ /ɛ œ ʌ ɔ/
⟨æ a⟩ /æ ɑ/

⟨m n ň ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t ť k ǩ q⟩ /p t c k q ʔ/
⟨b d ď g ǧ⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ ɢ/
⟨c č⟩ /t͡s t͡ʃ/
⟨f s š x ẍ h⟩ /f s ʃ x χ h/
⟨ʋ v z ž⟩ /ʋ v z ʒ/
⟨r ř y ȳ w⟩ /ɾ r j ɰ w/
⟨l ľ⟩ /l ʎ/

I’m a bit uncertain about some of these, particularly Plymouth ⟨v v̄⟩, Fake Spanish ⟨ť ǩ ď ǧ ʋ⟩, and pretty much the whole of the Fake Spanish vowel system (which seems just slightly too big to be plausible), but overall I’m fairly happy about most of this.
The Fake Spanish vowel system is actually right except the IPA letters are as in IPA and ï is /ɨ/.
Plymouth v plus long version is /æ æː/ and w and long are /ø øː/.
Fake Spanish t and d with Caron are dental fricatives (voiceless and voiced respectively), k and g with Caron are palatal stops.
Y with macron in Fake Spanish is actually /ʁ/.
Cotaili y-dot is /ç/.
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

bradrn wrote: Wed May 27, 2020 7:23 pm Pheasanti:

⟨a e i o u ʌ ə ü⟩ /a e i o u ʌ ɤ ɯ/
⟨ā ē ī ō ū ʌ̄ ə̄ û⟩ /aː eː iː oː uː ʌː ɤː ɯː/

⟨m n ny ng⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t ky/ty/c k⟩ /p t c k/
⟨b d dy/gy/j g⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ/
⟨f s sy/sh h⟩ /f s ʃ~ɕ h/
⟨v z zy/zh⟩ /v z ʒ~ʑ/
⟨l ly⟩ /l ʎ/
⟨r y w⟩ /r j w/

Robiin:

⟨a e i o u à ò ù⟩ /a e i o u ʌ ɤ ɯ/

⟨m n ñ⟩ /m n ɲ/
⟨p t k ʻ⟩ /p t k ʔ/
⟨b d ḑ g⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ/
⟨c ç⟩ /t͡s t͡ʃ~t͡ɕ/
⟨j ʒ⟩ /d͡z d͡ʒ~d͡ʑ/
⟨f s ş h⟩ /f s ʃ~ɕ x/
⟨v z z̧ ģ⟩ /v z ʒ~ʑ ɣ/
⟨r y w⟩ /r j w/
⟨l ł ļ⟩ /l ɬ ʎ/


Will post the rest later when I get time to do them.

(By the way, I’m just wondering: where did you get the names from?)
Well the ty/dy/ky/gy/c/j are actually affricates, either palatal or alveolo palatal.
Robiin r is actually /v͝r/ (yes a coarticulated fricative and trill). And j and ʒ are swapped around.

I got the names because of the different Birdish ethnicities.
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

Birdlang wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 9:46 am The Fake Spanish vowel system is actually right except the IPA letters are as in IPA and ï is /ɨ/.
So the close vowels are /i y ɨ ʉ ɯ u/ then? That sounds pretty extreme, especially since there are practically no known languages which contrast even both of /ɨ ɯ/.
Plymouth v plus long version is /æ æː/ and w and long are /ø øː/.
I’d be curious to know: why did you choose ⟨v⟩ for /æ/? That seems like a rather unusual choice to me.
Fake Spanish t and d with Caron are dental fricatives (voiceless and voiced respectively), k and g with Caron are palatal stops.
I was reluctant to assign ⟨ť ď⟩ to non-palatal stops, since natlangs seem to universally use them for palatals, but your assignment makes much more sense.
Birdlang wrote: Thu May 28, 2020 9:48 am Robiin r is actually /v͝r/ (yes a coarticulated fricative and trill).
I would never have guessed that, though I suspect you didn’t expect anyone to get that right.
I got the names because of the different Birdish ethnicities.
Are you seriously telling me that you have an ethnicity called ‘Fake Spanish’‽‽‽ (But admittedly that explanation does make sense for all the other ones.)
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

I don’t have a Fake Spanish ethnicity, but it’s sort of like a language that is called because the old spelling looked similar to Spanish so there were lots of phonemes spelled the same, it’s actually a Faekic language (all the language names are Fake + (natlang name, 10 known of these). The actual speakers is Birdanians (the name for the ethnic group with Birdish) (they speak 2 different languages, Birdish and Birdanian.

Here’s Birdanian
a â ä ã b c/tx d e ê f g ɣ h i î ĭ j k l ł m n ŋ ñ o ô ö õ p q/dj r s t u û ü ũ ŭ v w ẅ x y ÿ z
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

Birdanian:

⟨m n ñ ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t c/tx k⟩ /p t t͡ʃ k/
⟨b d q/dj g⟩ /b d d͡ʒ ɡ/
⟨f s x h⟩ /f s ʃ h/
⟨v z j ɣ⟩ /v z ʒ ɣ/
⟨r y ÿ w ẅ⟩ /r j ɥ w ɰ/
⟨l ł⟩ /l ɬ/

⟨a e i o u⟩ /ɑ e i o u/
⟨â ê î ô û⟩ /ɑː eː iː oː uː/
⟨ä ö ü⟩ /æ ɤ ɯ/
⟨ã õ ũ⟩ /ɑ̃ õ ũ/
⟨ǐ ǔ⟩ /ɪ ʊ/

I’m a bit unsure about ⟨ÿ ẅ⟩, but the rest I’m reasonably certain about.
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

bradrn wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2020 6:26 pm Birdanian:

⟨m n ñ ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t c/tx k⟩ /p t t͡ʃ k/
⟨b d q/dj g⟩ /b d d͡ʒ ɡ/
⟨f s x h⟩ /f s ʃ h/
⟨v z j ɣ⟩ /v z ʒ ɣ/
⟨r y ÿ w ẅ⟩ /r j ɥ w ɰ/
⟨l ł⟩ /l ɬ/

⟨a e i o u⟩ /ɑ e i o u/
⟨â ê î ô û⟩ /ɑː eː iː oː uː/
⟨ä ö ü⟩ /æ ɤ ɯ/
⟨ã õ ũ⟩ /ɑ̃ õ ũ/
⟨ǐ ǔ⟩ /ɪ ʊ/

I’m a bit unsure about ⟨ÿ ẅ⟩, but the rest I’m reasonably certain about.
The i and u with breve are for glides /i̯/ and /u̯/.

The tildes are for long umlaut vowels which are actually /æ œ y/.
E and o are actually /ɛ ɔ/.
But other than that you got it all right.
You even got ÿ and ẅ right.
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

An easy one:

⟨a b d e f g i k kh l lh m mb n nd ng ŋ p ph q s t th tl tlh ts tsh u w y⟩

And a less easy one:

⟨a ä b c d e ë ẽ f g gw ḡ h ꜧ ƕ i ï ĩ j k l m mb mp n nc nd ng nꜧ nj nk nq nt nw nw̃ ñ n̄ n̄w o ö õ p q r rr s š t u ü v w w̃ y z⟩

EDIT: Added some missing letters to second one
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

Bumping this as no-one has responded in a week:
bradrn wrote: Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:18 pm An easy one:

⟨a b d e f g i k kh l lh m mb n nd ng ŋ p ph q s t th tl tlh ts tsh u w y⟩

And a less easy one:

⟨a ä b c d e ë ẽ f g gw ḡ h ꜧ ƕ i ï ĩ j k l m mb mp n nc nd ng nꜧ nj nk nq nt nw nw̃ ñ n̄ n̄w o ö õ p q r rr s š t u ü v w w̃ y z⟩
(I know bumping is frowned upon here, but I hope it’s acceptable in this particular case…)
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

An easy one:

⟨a b d e f g i k kh l lh m mb n nd ng ŋ p ph q s t th tl tlh ts tsh u w y⟩
/a b d e f g i k kʰ l ɬ m ᵐb n ⁿd ᵑg ŋ p pʰ ʔ s t tʰ t͝ɬ t͝ɬʰ ʧ ʧʰ u β j/
And a less easy one:

⟨a ä b c d e ë ẽ f g gw ḡ h ꜧ ƕ i ï ĩ j k l m mb mp n nc nd ng nꜧ nj nk nq nt nw nw̃ ñ n̄ n̄w o ö õ p q r rr s š t u ü v w w̃ y z⟩
/a æ b ʧ d e ə ɛ̃ f g ɰ ɣ h g̊ ʍ i ɨ ĩ ʤ k l m ᵐb ᵐp n ᶮʧ ⁿd ᵑg ᵑg̊ ᶮʤ ᵑk ᶰq ⁿt nʷ nᶣ ɲ ŋ ŋʷ o ø ɔ̃ p q ɾ r~ʀ s ʃ t u y v w ɥ j z/

I found those both easy
Now for a different one
Modern Pigeonese
a á ä a̋ b ƀ c č d ď đ e é ê ế ë e̋ f g ǥ ḡ h ḥ i í j k ꝁ ḵ l ľ ƚ m n ŋ ň o ó ô ố ö ő p ꝑ r ř s š t ť ŧ u ú ŭ ŭ́ ü ű v ʋ w ẃ y ý z ž ɂ ə
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

Birdlang wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 4:57 am An easy one:

⟨a b d e f g i k kh l lh m mb n nd ng ŋ p ph q s t th tl tlh ts tsh u w y⟩
/a b d e f g i k kʰ l ɬ m ᵐb n ⁿd ᵑg ŋ p pʰ ʔ s t tʰ t͝ɬ t͝ɬʰ ʧ ʧʰ u β j/
Correct (except for ⟨ts tsh w⟩, which should be /t͡s t͡sʰ w/).
And a less easy one:

⟨a ä b c d e ë ẽ f g gw ḡ h ꜧ ƕ i ï ĩ j k l m mb mp n nc nd ng nꜧ nj nk nq nt nw nw̃ ñ n̄ n̄w o ö õ p q r rr s š t u ü v w w̃ y z⟩
/a æ b ʧ d e ə ɛ̃ f g ɰ ɣ h g̊ ʍ i ɨ ĩ ʤ k l m ᵐb ᵐp n ᶮʧ ⁿd ᵑg ᵑg̊ ᶮʤ ᵑk ᶰq ⁿt nʷ nᶣ ɲ ŋ ŋʷ o ø ɔ̃ p q ɾ r~ʀ s ʃ t u y v w ɥ j z/
Mostly incorrect. (Told you it was less easy.) Here’s what I have:
More: show

Code: Select all

i ü ï u			/i y ɨ u/
 ĩ			/ɪ/
e ö ë o			/e ø ɘ o/
ẽ     õ			/ɛ     ɔ/
a   ä			/æ   ɑ/



m  n  ñ  n̄  n̄w	/ m  n  ɲ   ŋ  ŋʷ/
p  t  c  k  q  ꜧ  w̃	/ p  t  tʃ  k  kʷ  ʔ  ʔʷ~w̰/
mp nt nc nk nq nꜧ nw̃	/ᵐp ⁿt ᶮtʃ ᵑk ᵑkʷ ᵑʔ ᵑʔʷ~ᵑw̰/
b  d  j  g  gw		/ b  d  dʒ  ɡ  ɡʷ/
mb nd nj ng nw		/ᵐb ⁿd ᶮdʒ ᵑɡ ᵑɡʷ/
f  s  š			/ f  s  ʃ/
v  z  y  ḡ  w  h  ƕ	/ v  z  ʒ   ɣ  w   h  hʷ~ʍ/
l r rr			/l ɾ r/
(And also: how is /g̊/ different to /k/?)
I found those both easy
Now for a different one
Modern Pigeonese
a á ä a̋ b ƀ c č d ď đ e é ê ế ë e̋ f g ǥ ḡ h ḥ i í j k ꝁ ḵ l ľ ƚ m n ŋ ň o ó ô ố ö ő p ꝑ r ř s š t ť ŧ u ú ŭ ŭ́ ü ű v ʋ w ẃ y ý z ž ɂ ə
I’ll do this one later when I get some more time.
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

bradrn wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 5:50 am
Birdlang wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 4:57 am An easy one:

⟨a b d e f g i k kh l lh m mb n nd ng ŋ p ph q s t th tl tlh ts tsh u w y⟩
/a b d e f g i k kʰ l ɬ m ᵐb n ⁿd ᵑg ŋ p pʰ ʔ s t tʰ t͝ɬ t͝ɬʰ ʧ ʧʰ u β j/
Correct (except for ⟨ts tsh w⟩, which should be /t͡s t͡sʰ w/).
And a less easy one:

⟨a ä b c d e ë ẽ f g gw ḡ h ꜧ ƕ i ï ĩ j k l m mb mp n nc nd ng nꜧ nj nk nq nt nw nw̃ ñ n̄ n̄w o ö õ p q r rr s š t u ü v w w̃ y z⟩
/a æ b ʧ d e ə ɛ̃ f g ɰ ɣ h g̊ ʍ i ɨ ĩ ʤ k l m ᵐb ᵐp n ᶮʧ ⁿd ᵑg ᵑg̊ ᶮʤ ᵑk ᶰq ⁿt nʷ nᶣ ɲ ŋ ŋʷ o ø ɔ̃ p q ɾ r~ʀ s ʃ t u y v w ɥ j z/
Mostly incorrect. (Told you it was less easy.) Here’s what I have:
More: show

Code: Select all

i ü ï u			/i y ɨ u/
 ĩ			/ɪ/
e ö ë o			/e ø ɘ o/
ẽ     õ			/ɛ     ɔ/
a   ä			/æ   ɑ/



m  n  ñ  n̄  n̄w	/ m  n  ɲ   ŋ  ŋʷ/
p  t  c  k  q  ꜧ  w̃	/ p  t  tʃ  k  kʷ  ʔ  ʔʷ~w̰/
mp nt nc nk nq nꜧ nw̃	/ᵐp ⁿt ᶮtʃ ᵑk ᵑkʷ ᵑʔ ᵑʔʷ~ᵑw̰/
b  d  j  g  gw		/ b  d  dʒ  ɡ  ɡʷ/
mb nd nj ng nw		/ᵐb ⁿd ᶮdʒ ᵑɡ ᵑɡʷ/
f  s  š			/ f  s  ʃ/
v  z  y  ḡ  w  h  ƕ	/ v  z  ʒ   ɣ  w   h  hʷ~ʍ/
l r rr			/l ɾ r/
(And also: how is /g̊/ different to /k/?)
I found those both easy
Now for a different one
Modern Pigeonese
a á ä a̋ b ƀ c č d ď đ e é ê ế ë e̋ f g ǥ ḡ h ḥ i í j k ꝁ ḵ l ľ ƚ m n ŋ ň o ó ô ố ö ő p ꝑ r ř s š t ť ŧ u ú ŭ ŭ́ ü ű v ʋ w ẃ y ý z ž ɂ ə
I’ll do this one later when I get some more time.
Thanks,
The k I thought of as aspirated but I forgot about it, and g devoiced was kind of for an unaspirated version.
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

Birdlang wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:08 am The k I thought of as aspirated but I forgot about it, and g devoiced was kind of for an unaspirated version.
I suspected it would be something like that.

Now, Modern Pigeonese:

⟨m n ň ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t ť k ɂ⟩ /p t c k ʔ/
⟨b d ď g⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ/
⟨c č⟩ /ts t͡ʃ/
⟨ꝑ f ŧ s š ꝁ ḵ ḥ h⟩ /ɸ f θ s ʃ x χ ħ h/
⟨ƀ ʋ đ z ž ǥ ḡ⟩ /β b ð z ʒ ɣ ʁ/
⟨j v l ľ ƚ r ř⟩ /j w l ʎ ɬ r r̥/

⟨ä a ê ô e ö ə ë o i ü ŭ u y w⟩ /æ ɑ ɛ ɔ e ø ə ɤ o i y ɯ u/
Acute accent added to vowels (or diaeresis → double-acute) to mark stress.
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

bradrn wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:12 am
Birdlang wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:08 am The k I thought of as aspirated but I forgot about it, and g devoiced was kind of for an unaspirated version.
I suspected it would be something like that.

Now, Modern Pigeonese:

⟨m n ň ŋ⟩ /m n ɲ ŋ/
⟨p t ť k ɂ⟩ /p t c k ʔ/
⟨b d ď g⟩ /b d ɟ ɡ/
⟨c č⟩ /ts t͡ʃ/
⟨ꝑ f ŧ s š ꝁ ḵ ḥ h⟩ /ɸ f θ s ʃ x χ ħ h/
⟨ƀ ʋ đ z ž ǥ ḡ⟩ /β b ð z ʒ ɣ ʁ/
⟨j v l ľ ƚ r ř⟩ /j w l ʎ ɬ r r̥/

⟨ä a ê ô e ö ə ë o i ü ŭ u y w⟩ /æ ɑ ɛ ɔ e ø ə ɤ o i y ɯ u/
Acute accent added to vowels (or diaeresis → double-acute) to mark stress.
Ok
Acute accent is for length.
The nasals and stops are right, but k and g with macron are uvular stops.
The schwa is a voiced pharyngeal fricative.
The r and ř are /ɾ r/ respectively.
Vowels (plus one that’s actually a consonant) are actually in that order /æ a e o ɛ ø ʕ ɤ ɔ i y ʌ u ʊi̯ ɯ/.
Darren
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Darren »

I'm interested to see how people will work out Fiyfuenuwfuwa.

<c e f g ia io iw iy m n o ua ue uw uy>

And here's a sample of gibberish to help you:
Muwniamiy-iy-gio e cuacoguy-gio geciwcuw moniw-fe, e muamiofiw-fio.
bradrn
Posts: 6257
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:25 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by bradrn »

Darren wrote: Sun Jun 21, 2020 3:18 am I'm interested to see how people will work out Fiyfuenuwfuwa.

<c e f g ia io iw iy m n o ua ue uw uy>

And here's a sample of gibberish to help you:
Muwniamiy-iy-gio e cuacoguy-gio geciwcuw moniw-fe, e muamiofiw-fio.
Your language name doesn’t seem to be compatible with your romanization — it seems to use a letter ⟨a⟩ which doesn’t exist in the romanization.

Anyway, I’m not quite sure about this, but here’s my best guess:

Consonants:

Consonants can occur palatalised or labiovelarised.

Palatalised: ⟨m n c f g⟩ /mʲ ɲ c ç j/
Labiovelarised: ⟨m n c f g⟩ /mˠ ŋʷ kʷ ɸʷ~ʍ w/

Vowels:

These vowels palatalise the previous consonant (if any): ⟨ia e io iy iw⟩ /ʲa ʲe~ʲi ʲo~ʲu ʲy ʲɯ/
These vowels labiovelarise the previous consonant (if any): ⟨ua ue o uy uw⟩ /ʷa ʷy ʷe~ʷi ʷo~ʷu ʷy ʷɯ/

EDIT: Changed order of vowels lists to something a bit more intuitive

Sample text:

Muwniamiy-iy-gio e cuacoguy-gio geciwcuw moniw-fe, e muamiofiw-fio
/mˠɯnʲamʲyyjo i kʷakʷowyju jecɯcɯ mˠunʲɯçi | i mˠamʲuçɯçu/
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

(Why does phpBB not let me add >5 links here?)
Karch
Posts: 577
Joined: Sun Jul 15, 2018 6:09 am

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Karch »

<c e f g ia io iw iy m n o ua ue uw uy>
/pʷ pʲ tʷ tʲ kʷ kʲ mʷ mʲ nʲ ŋʷ j w/ <fu fi cu ci gu gi mu mi ni nu i u>
/i u e o a/ <i~y u~w e o a>
/ʲe ʷo/ <e o>
Non-front vowels are fronted before palatal(ized) consonants.
Voiceless stops are voiced intervocalically. Word-initially, the most common allophones of the labial and alveolar stops tend to be [pɸʷ pç tʷ~ʦʷ ʧ], whereas intervocalically, the most common allophones are [βʷ~w βʲ dʷ ʤ].
The sequences /iji/ and /uwu/ often contract into long vowels.

Muwniamiy-iy-gio e cuacoguy-gio geciwcuw moniw-fe, e muamiofiw-fio.
/mʷunʲamʲijikʲo je tʷatʷokʷikʲo kʲetʲutʷu mʷonʲupʲe | je mʷamʲopʲupʲo/
[mʷunʲæmʲi:ɡʲɵ je tʷɑdʷoɡʷɪɡʲo kʲeʤʉdʷu mʷonʲʉβʲe | je mʷɑmʲɵβʲʉβʲɵ]

The name, assuming it's actually spelled Fiyfuenuwfua, is this pronounced /pʲipʷeŋʷupʷa/ [pçɪweŋʷuwa].
Zpaf kkuñb ñvneahttiñ wqxirftvn meof ñfañhsit.
Kkuñb ñvzxirf kvtañb kkuñf ñtmeaq sfañkqeanth.
Yvnmuq. Yvnmuq. Yvnmuq. Yvnmuq. Yvnmuq. Yvnmuq. Yvnmuq.
Birdlang
Posts: 122
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Birdlang »

How about my Malayo Polynesian language? This orthography is based off of Indonesian regional languages.
a b c d e é f g gh gy h i j k kh ky l m n ng ny o ó p r s sy t u eu w y z ʼ
Darren
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:38 pm

Re: Reverse Rominazation Challenge Thread, v2.0

Post by Darren »

bradrn wrote: Sun Jun 21, 2020 4:20 am Your language name doesn’t seem to be compatible with your romanization — it seems to use a letter ⟨a⟩ which doesn’t exist in the romanization.
You're right, it should be Fiyfuenuwfuwua.
Anyway, I’m not quite sure about this, but here’s my best guess:

Consonants:

Consonants can occur palatalised or labiovelarised.

Palatalised: ⟨m n c f g⟩ /mʲ ɲ c ç j/
Labiovelarised: ⟨m n c f g⟩ /mˠ ŋʷ kʷ ɸʷ~ʍ w/

Vowels:

These vowels palatalise the previous consonant (if any): ⟨ia e io iy iw⟩ /ʲa ʲe~ʲi ʲo~ʲu ʲy ʲɯ/
These vowels labiovelarise the previous consonant (if any): ⟨ua ue o uy uw⟩ /ʷa ʷy ʷe~ʷi ʷo~ʷu ʷy ʷɯ/
You got the system of palatals and labials entirely right, but the actual values are different. The consonants <c m n g f> are [p~s, m~ɥ, ɺʷ~n, ŋʷ~z~j, ɸ~ɕ] (g is [z] before front vowels and [j] otherwise). The palatalising vowels are /ʲi ʲə ʲe ʲa ʲɒ/ <iy iw e ia io> which are [ɟi dʑə ɟe dʑa gɒ] when following a vowel or word-initially, and the labialising vowels are /ʷɨ ʷu ʷø ʷa ʷɒ/ <uy uw ue ua o> which become [vɨ gʷu vø va gʷɒ].

The sample text
Muwniamiy-iy-gio e cuacoguy-gio geciwcuw moniw-fe, e muamiofiw-fio.
[mu.na.ɥi-ɟi-jɒ ɟe pa.pɒ.ŋʷɨ-jɒ ze.sə.pu mɒ.nə-ɕe ɟe ma.ɥɒ.ɕə-ɕɒ]

karch wrote: <c e f g ia io iw iy m n o ua ue uw uy>
/pʷ pʲ tʷ tʲ kʷ kʲ mʷ mʲ nʲ ŋʷ j w/ <fu fi cu ci gu gi mu mi ni nu i u>
/i u e o a/ <i~y u~w e o a>
/ʲe ʷo/ <e o>
Non-front vowels are fronted before palatal(ized) consonants.
Voiceless stops are voiced intervocalically. Word-initially, the most common allophones of the labial and alveolar stops tend to be [pɸʷ pç tʷ~ʦʷ ʧ], whereas intervocalically, the most common allophones are [βʷ~w βʲ dʷ ʤ].
The sequences /iji/ and /uwu/ often contract into long vowels.

Muwniamiy-iy-gio e cuacoguy-gio geciwcuw moniw-fe, e muamiofiw-fio.
/mʷunʲamʲijikʲo je tʷatʷokʷikʲo kʲetʲutʷu mʷonʲupʲe | je mʷamʲopʲupʲo/
[mʷunʲæmʲi:ɡʲɵ je tʷɑdʷoɡʷɪɡʲo kʲeʤʉdʷu mʷonʲʉβʲe | je mʷɑmʲɵβʲʉβʲɵ]
This is the same sort of idea, and I could equally analyse the palatalisation and labialisation onto the consonants with a vowel system of something like [i~ɨ, ɨ~u, e~ø, a, ɒ], and /p ɟ dʑ g gʷ m n ŋʷ ɺʷ j~z ɥ ɸ v s ɕ/ for the consonants.
Post Reply